Condenser Replacement - 87 Fifth Avenue

Justwondering

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The condenser arrived late yesterday evening.
So the plan is to get up early and get this installed so I can have a/c in the chrysler by the end of the week!

The quick version:
1. This will take about 3 hours including the time for set up and take down, the 2 siezed bolts you'll have to spray and wait to back off, and the frustration of realizing you have to figure this out yourself because the manual is next to useless for this job.
2. Unless you plan to jack up the front of the car, the condenser has to come out through the top. This means you have to unbolt the latching/horn assembly and brackets as well as the condenser to pull it up.
3. You'll need 1/2 inch, 7/16 inch and for some reason I needed a 5/16 inch socket. I think someone had already mucked with the front end of this jalopy before we got it.
4. After you put everything back together, ease the hood down on the latch/catch. Mine migrated and caused the hood to bind on one side. So if yours is off a bit, you could wack the crap out of the side of the hood or the top of the fender.


Let the day begin!
IMG_4441.jpg


Condenser:
IMG_4490.jpg


The plan is to have the job finished and be back upstairs before husband gets up. He had a pretty rough night trying to breath, so I'm probably going to get at least 2 hours before he's up and around.
IMG_4442.jpg

Take a moment and admire the flower basket he planted and hung up for me.
IMG_4443.jpg

And admire the coolish morning, birds chirping, and light thunderstorm over in the east before the sun gets up. The owls were talking this morning, but when I tried to get the video all you could hear were the frogs in the pond and the redbird chirping.
 

Justwondering

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Get the manual out and look for help.
IMG_4447.jpg

Nothing here , but lets look through every page because you cannot believe there are no references to the condenser.
IMG_4448.jpg

Nope
IMG_4449.jpg

Not here either.
IMG_4450.jpg

What the heck?

Eventually I realize there is next to nothing in the service manual. There was this nifty diagram:
IMG_4456.jpg

So you can have confidence that some engineer somewhere back in time thought it was important you understand the top level overview of the a/c system!
And finally there is this lovely diagram:
IMG_4455.jpg

Seems to indicate there are 4 bolts, one at each of the corners of the condenser.
If life were just that simple.
 
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Justwondering

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Make 5 trips to the building to get the most likely items you need for this effort.
IMG_4458.jpg

Socket set.

IMG_4460.jpg

Last time I tried nitrile gloves and they kept ripping.
This time I'm trying vinyl gloves. Lord only knows why I thought I needed dielectric grease-- you don't. Never used the longnose pliers either.
Used plenty of bug spray. Put nuts and bolts in the plastic bag.

This would also be a good time to go back in and get the penetrating fluid for the two stubborn bolts in your future.
IMG_4479.jpg


Something soft to kneel on or lay on when the rocks bother your back.
IMG_4457.jpg
 

Justwondering

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Now if you are really lucky, you'll have some very fine looking wire mesh left over from some other project that has been added as a bug screen for the front of the condenser.

You'll need to backoff the bolts on each side.
IMG_4462.jpg


IMG_4463.jpg

Remove the light bulb from the passenger side:
IMG_4464.jpg


At this point, I would drop down and un bolt everything necessary from the bottom. If you continue working from the top and unbolt everything then when you go to the bottom, gravity will pull that condenser down to the ground.
Which would be fine except you have to remove it through the top.
So do as I say, not as I did.

Get on the ground and undo the bottom bolts.
IMG_4478.jpg

This one was on bottom right. It was siezed up and would not come off the condenser.

Bottom left:
IMG_4477.jpg

This bolt backed off correctly, but since I did it 2nd, I thought it was busted. In truth, the first one is busted. It never released off the condenser. Its still sitting on the old condenser wet with pb blaster fluid.
 
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Justwondering

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I proceeded to unbolt the vertical bracket that holds the latch/catch. Which means that I had to unbolt the horizontal assembly above that holds the latch and remove everything to make enough space to pull the condenser.

So here are the bottom bolts:
IMG_4473.jpg

You'll notice there is this short plastic skirt with broken/cracked openings that is sitting in front of this bracket. Apparently, whomever put this on before took many short cuts.

Figured I might as well get the skirt out of there and fix the plastic on it since I'm already on the ground anyway.
IMG_4474.jpg

There were four screws that I removed. Two on each side.
Here is what I removed.
IMG_4501.jpg

Here is a close up of the two passenger side areas that need to be fixed.
IMG_4500.jpg


I don't understand the purpose of this skirt.
It sits behind and below the condenser and the radiator so it isn't protecting the bottom of them. This is obvious since the lower edge of my condenser has smushed in places all across it.

It doesn't act as a skid plate, because it is primarily vertical. There is no horizontal area to 'protect' anything under the engine.

But I don't plan to revisit the service manual since that was such a waste of time earlier.

I'll just fix it and put it back later this week.
 
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Justwondering

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Back to the top.
Unplug the two horns. Very simple slide on connectors over a flat blade. No tabs.
IMG_4485.jpg

Imagine if you will, that hand in the upper right has fingers that are pulling the plug off the flat blade of the red horn. You can't see it because of the horizontal assembly in the way. There is a second plug on the other horn on the driver side.
The same wiring harness has both plugs on it.

There are two bolts holding on the latch/catch. I backed them off and removed it.
IMG_4487.jpg


In the center of the photo are to areas where you can see all the way to the ground. There is a bolt on either side..parallel to the ground. You have to back them off to get the latch assembly off.

After you remove the latch assembly, you'll see there is a wire hung through a slot on the bottom. That is your hood release cable. Push the cable end up and out of the slot and it comes free. Put these things aside.

I chose to free the vertical bracket -- the one that has its bottom two bolts at that funky skirt at the bottom. I chose to free that bracket from the horizontal bracket/latch assembly. Pulled all the pieces out one at at time.

My thinking was, smaller pieces would be easier to handle and less likely to wack into the side of the condenser which would crush the fins.

There are three bolts holding the horizontal bracket in place:
IMG_4481.jpg

You can see the studs sticking out where I already removed the nuts off them.

Now I had to 'encourage' the driver side of the bracket to get it out between the grill and the frame. Firm movement, don't force it, and it helps to angle the passenger side up first.

Here are all the pieces:
IMG_4488.jpg
 

Justwondering

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New vs old condenser:
IMG_4491.jpg

IMG_4493.jpg


The new condenser is narrower for 2 reasons:
1. The tubes running horizontal are not parallel, but rather staggered at an angle so the manufacturer can get them in a smaller space - less metal - less cost
2. The tubes themselves are smaller in diameter. R134a and R12 have different molecule sizes, different efficient levels.

I'm sure someone can chime in on the particular specifics. But, what you really need to know is that this gives you more space for air to flow as well as it is much lighter which means major fuel savings (lol).

IMG_4498.jpg

I still haven't gotten this jewel off and probably never will. Will just replace it with a new one on the the new condenser.

I tested the car to make sure it would run.
Shut the hood and grimaced with the noise.
Opened the hood and realized things didn't line up well, so adjusted the hood to shut better.
Put my tools up.

Check the clock:
IMG_4502.jpg


Back upstairs, no one is up yet.

Fix breakfast:
IMG_4503.jpg


Go wake hubby and start my day.
 

360 mafia

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What?No metric bolts to deal with? If you look in the very small a/c section of your repair manual,it will say only trained tech should perform this work.But they dont tell you what to do when they are all retired or pushing up daiseys 30 years after the manual was written
 

Aspen500

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Don't worry, service manuals aren't much different for a 2016 models. Trust me.........They go into detail, like you said, on engine overhaul for example but how to replace an A/C evaporator, you get an exploded view with each part numbered and a legend as to what they are. Step one will say "Remove instrument panel". Basically you just start taking pieces off until you get to where you want to be. Can't forget the hidden fasteners they somehow forget to tell you about and WHERE THEY ARE. How often does an engine get overhauled these days in the field? Never. How often do you have to replace an evaporator? Quite often. Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr. Some manufacturers are better than others. Mercedes SUCKS, Ford is half ways decent, Chrysler is somewhere in between and heaven forbid you get stuck working on a Land Rover. Audi? Theirs are translated from German and a lot gets lost in the translation it seems. Some procedures you read 5 times and still say "HUH?" What you just read makes no sense whatsoever.

As always, you posts are a joy to read! You should become a writer.
 

Justwondering

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Aspen500 - I think I'll just continue to muddy up the forum with my ramblings. Gives folks something to read that doesn't involve gear ratios and rpms. Basically, because I know nothing about the technical side.

I still love the acronym WOT (what?)...makes me smile when I see it. Wide Open Throttle, there needs to be a race horse named that.
 

Justwondering

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My brother just informed me the molecule size has nothing to do with the new design for the condenser. Rolled his eyes and said no like a dozen times.
Agrees with the reduced expense cause there is much less metal.
Agrees with the better cooling since the refrigerant has a shorter distance to get around in the tubes cause they are smaller.

So, in this house anyway, the molecules are a non-starter as a reason for the redesign of the condenser. Lord knows I don't want to come off as a dumb blonde (no offense to the blonde boys out there).
 

7T8 Custom

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I proceeded to unbolt the vertical bracket that holds the latch/catch. Which means that I had to unbolt the horizontal assembly above that holds the latch and remove everything to make enough space to pull the condenser.

So here are the bottom bolts:
View attachment 15800
You'll notice there is this short plastic skirt with broken/cracked openings that is sitting in front of this bracket. Apparently, whomever put this on before took many short cuts.

Figured I might as well get the skirt out of there and fix the plastic on it since I'm already on the ground anyway.
View attachment 15801
There were four screws that I removed. Two on each side.
Here is what I removed.
View attachment 15802
Here is a close up of the two passenger side areas that need to be fixed.
View attachment 15803

I don't understand the purpose of this skirt.
It sits behind and below the condenser and the radiator so it isn't protecting the bottom of them. This is obvious since the lower edge of my condenser has smushed in places all across it.

It doesn't act as a skid plate, because it is primarily vertical. There is no horizontal area to 'protect' anything under the engine.

But I don't plan to revisit the service manual since that was such a waste of time earlier.

I'll just fix it and put it back later this week.
That skirt thingy is an air dam to help direct airflow into the rad and condenser for cooling.
 

Justwondering

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Well that would make sense. Its now on my list to fix, so I'll make sure it gets done and back on.
 

Aspen500

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There's also another acronym besides WOT that means the same thing and that is WFO. Which one you use all depends on where you are and who is there, lol.
 

Justwondering

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Master M , swing by and pick up Aspen500 and come on by. Breakfast with homegrown chicken eggs, homemade jelly, and there will be coffee - decaf or regular we keep both here.:)
 

Justwondering

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Good news is the new condenser is fine

Bad news is the a/c compressor is leaking at the front seal

Has anyone successfully rehabbed a front seal or do I need to get a new compressor?
 

Aspen500

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I have replaced compressor seals in the past (at work) and they all came out fine but that was using the special tools called for in the service manual. The practice of repairing compressors in the field pretty much faded away in the early '90's. The seals are a ceramic material and if not installed precisely could be damaged and WILL leak. Not even sure if you can buy seals separate anymore to be honest.
Good chance though, if the seal is leaking that the compressor might be worn to the point it'd be money ahead to just replace it.
 

Justwondering

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That's what dearth car told me as well. Sigh. I already blew my June budget on an ac compressor for the suburban. Will have to get creative
 
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