Volare Wagon - T/A Kit Racer Stance

Opticon77

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Pile of parts awaiting install:

ART Sub frame connectors (Final batch)
FF K-frame aluminum pucks
FF Rear Iso delete kit w/ sway bar mounts
Westar and Marmon HD Engine and Trans mounts
FF Fast Ratio Pitman/Idler arms
FF 11/16" Tie rod kit
FF Tubular upper control arms
Proforged HD lower balljoints
Energy Suspension Black Poly LCA bushing kit
FF 1-1/8" Front swaybar
FF 7/8" Rear swaybar
Vi-King Warrior bound/rebound adjustable shocks all around

Awaiting availability:
FF HD torsion bars
FF LCA bracing

I should find some way to document before/after. Maybe record through some specific backroad twisties hard-mounted with hoodline and steering wheel as reference points. I'll work on this.
 

DCAspen

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Nice selection of parts,Keep us updated,Should ride like a slot car with all those goodies.
 

BudW

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I agree on what DCAspen said.

Only two comments to mention:
Energy Suspension Black Poly LCA bushing kit
might be a big harsh for daily driving. All of the other parts will car feel and handle better - except for possibly the shocks (no information about them to say one way or the other).
My experience with urethane or polyurethane bushings for both upper and lower control arms is they are a bit "too stiff" for street usage. For racing, go for it.
You will appreciate some rubber between the you and the pebbles, grass and bugs you drive over - before it shakes your kidneys to a different location in your body.
I recommend to go Poly (or urethane) for all suspension parts, except for upper/lower control arm bushings - or at least get a second set of lower control arms and get new rubber installed - so if poly is too stiff for ya, it won't be hard to swap 'em out.

My other comment is . . . it sounds like you have a lighter wallet, now . . .
BudW
 

Opticon77

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I do have an old set of Moog rubber control arm bushings laying around from my Chrysler that I never put in. I'll keep them handy as a Plan B.

And yes... I told you Firm Feel would remember my name.
 

Duke5A

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I'm hoping for lots photos of this build. :) This is basically porn for me... :confused::eek:

Can you post a photo of those upper control arms? I had to modify mine to clear. That piece of flat stock reinforcement between the bars has to be clearanced in the middle, otherwise it will it when the suspension is unloaded. FF admitted this to me and said they were going to redesign them. I think I did the install like six or seven years ago.
 

Raff

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I do have an old set of Moog rubber control arm bushings laying around from my Chrysler that I never put in. I'll keep them handy as a Plan B.

And yes... I told you Firm Feel would remember my name.

I think you'll be on their Xmas card list this year!! Keep us posted with lots of pics. Car looks awesome.
 

Opticon77

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Got these to put in...

2019-05-15.jpg



I'm waiting on rebuilding the front end so I can do it all in a single K frame drop. But I did want to slip these new FFI aluminum pucks in for reasons you can probably gather from the following photo.

2019-05-19.jpg


Warning to anyone thinking they were going to loosen the Kframe, drop it a couple inches with a pole jack, and "slide" spacers in; There is a metal guide sleeve tacked to the upper bushing retainer (traveling though both halves of the rubber bushing) that will NOT allow you to slide the top bushing out without a good 4" of clearance... but as you lower the Kframe the upper control arms contact the top of the frame rails right around the 3" mark.

OOPS! Your options are now...

A) Disconnect the upper control arm mounting plates from the K frame uprights.
-or-
B) Cut the exposed inch of metal guide sleeve off so the upper bushing can slide out.

Anyone here know what "flat rate pay" is? I didn't take any photos myself but it goes a little something like...

REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
DblVdjlW4AI-Nlm.jpg



And then everything is just fine.


2019-05-19.jpg
 

Duke5A

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Love it! Easily one of my favorite builds.

Extremely interested in your feedback on those shocks too.
 

Opticon77

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I've been doing my research on damper adjustment so as to do them justice. "Flat Ride" or "Fast Settling" suspension design is an interesting concept I'd like to play with. 15-20% higher rear ride frequency to limit the need for damping and therefore reduce the effects of jacking (up or down depending on your Compression/Rebound settings). It just so happens that these cars tend to have higher rear ride frequency in the first place, thanks to the torsion bars, making the theory pretty easy to test.
 

Opticon77

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They built all 4 to order under kit "VSK2001" (fronts listed as "B2001" and rears as "B2008"). I didn't see any stud/stud numbers available in the universal fitment list and I got spooked so I called up Viking and they happily verified the correct mounting hardware and operating dimensions for me over the phone. Great customer service.

I AM going to suggest waiting for me to install and test clearance on those adjuster knobs though. The shock clearance hole in the K frame upright looks pretty tight. I'll get on it.
 

XfbodyX

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For comparison sake if you get a chance can you measure the shock body and the diameter of the adjusted knobs?

Ive been wanting to try Viking units because ive heard alot of good about them.

If they wont clear up front because of the adjuster diameter I wonder if you could fit or make some smaller ones.

I use a different brand with a 6 inch circumference body and adjusters exactly the size of a common dime.

Viking was founded in 2011 by the two top guys from QA1 and im told the quality has gone downhill although ive had no issues with my older ones.

DSC00080.JPG


DSC00081.JPG


DSC00082.JPG


DSC00083.JPG
 

Opticon77

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6.25" girth and the same knobs. Although they might be positioned closer together. And they ARE mounted on the bottom (lower control arm) side so they should have the best chance of clearing everything.

2019-05-20.jpg
 

Opticon77

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They have a few buyers lined up and they have a production run planned. Sounded like it would be a few month ordeal in all.
 

BudW

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Warning to anyone thinking they were going to loosen the Kframe, drop it a couple inches with a pole jack, and "slide" spacers in; There is a metal guide sleeve tacked to the upper bushing retainer (traveling though both halves of the rubber bushing) that will NOT allow you to slide the top bushing out without a good 4" of clearance... but as you lower the Kframe the upper control arms contact the top of the frame rails right around the 3" mark.
The upper control arm plates do need to come off to do the job correctly.

A method I have used in the past (when not dropping the entire K-frame down), is to:
First EITHER Measure the distance from floor to fender well and record somewhere. I recommend adding a piece of masking tape so measurement location will remain the same. OR the official way is to measure from floor to bottom of control arm bushing (and record) – which is not as easy to perform.

Loosen all four K-frame bolts. Drilling a small hole into frame rail to insert rust penetrating oil straw (or less preferred, WD40) to soak the bolts, a couple of times, a couple of days in advanced – might be recommended. Also, use penetrating fluid on any suspension fasteners you can see, including shock studs (sometimes easier to access with front wheels off) and on the torsion bar adjustment bolt threads.

Remove front wheels

Remove the plates that cover the upper control arm fasteners, from inside of engine compartment. Depending on year of production, it would be painted black steel, or unfinished aluminum plates – as shown in red circle (under the air cleaner hose)).
20170503_161425 r.jpg

For my personal cars, I like to leave the plates off - so that way the alignment shop wont lose or damage the plates or screws. Then reattach the plates once you are happy with the alignment.

Support the K-frame from below. A transmission jack attachment works great in this case (if available).

Loosen the tension from torsion bars via the adjustment bolts. They do not need to be completely loose but mostly loose does make job go faster.

Be sure to count and record how many turns/rotations you make when loosening the torsion bar bolts! If you tighten those torsion bar bolts back to same turns/rotations, then ride height should end up very close before this operation was started and less time spent overall.

Leave the four (two per side) upper control nuts to studs alone (blue arrow, below) for loosening them will cause your alignment to be off afterwards. By leaving them alone, the alignment should be the same before vs. after.
77 FSM pg 2-12c m.jpg


Remove cotter pin between upper ball joint to spindle (Chrysler calls this a knuckle). Remove the upper ball joint nut and disconnect the ball joint from spindle/knuckle using an appropriate tool.

Remove the lower shock nut. I recommend changing shocks in our cars at this point because they wear out in time and, sometimes, it can be impossible to remove those nuts – which means cutting off the nuts (studs) might be easier.
I find it easier to remove the lower shock nut in car, and upper nut on the workbench – but your experience might differ.

Loosen all eight (four per side) support bracket (red arrow and purple circles, above) to K-frame bolts. Remove the four bolts and plate on Left side – but don’t remove the Right side, yet (there is a reason for doing Left first) – if replacing K-frame bushings only. If you plan on dropping the K-frame as an assembly, then go ahead and remove all eight bolts (both sides) at once. Remove the upper control arm, support bracket and shock straight up and off. This would be a good time to attach the new shock, if changing them that is, to support bracket. If a gas shock, keep the wire or strap in place – if possible.

With car supported (on a lift or on jack stands) and K-frame support, remove the four 4 K-frame bolts.

Lower K-frame down. The Right side bracket will contact the frame after a certain distance – which should allow the Left side to drop down, more. Some cases, the Left side rear bushing will slip out – sometimes not. If not, it is time to get out the Sawzall and cut through the bushing and metal insert to remove. I would plan on keeping the saw nearby, just in case. Install the Left side solid mounts (leave bolts out for now, or things will bind up later. Raise K-frame up and re-install the Left side support bracket/control arm/shock in place, first. Go ahead and tighten the bolts attaching the bracket to the K-frame to 50 ft/lbs. (222 nm).

Repeat for Right side, but for me, most often the bushings will pop right out (no saw needed – in most cases).

Once the Right side support bracket is reattached, then install the four K-frame bolts. Once all four bolts are in and sung, tighten to specs (see below).

If you loosened the upper control arm bolts, then tighten nuts down to 150 ft/lbs. (667 nm). Note alignment will be off so you will need to get car aligned afterwards, if those nuts were loosened!
Most cars need an alignment every 30k miles or so anyway - even if you did not affect alignment angles for this.

Turn torsion bar bolts back to the number of turns you loosened them to, to get ride height back to an approximate height.
The official factory ride height (lower part of lower control arm bushing to ground) is:
1977 FSM (Factory Service Manual) is 10½” (266.7 mm)
1982-1989 FSM is 12½” (317.5 mm)
I don’t have the official specs for other year FMJ’s.
If you measured the fender well height earlier, you can still use that to get back to original height (which doesn’t mean it is correct). Changing the ride height does affect most alignment angles – so it is good idea to take time to get right height correct, before taking car to get aligned.
Also, once you have the correct ride height set, using the fender well measurement will work for future reference.

Torque specs are:
K-frame bolts (unless the solid mount supplier suggests otherwise): 80 ft/lbs. (355 nm)
Upper control arm nuts: 150 ft/lbs. (667 nm)
Support to K-frame bolts: 50 ft/lbs. (222 nm)
Upper control arm pivot arm to bushing nuts (for bushing replacement, only) 110 ft/lbs. (489 nm)
BudW
 

Opticon77

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The upper control arm plates do need to come off to do the job correctly...

Measure the distance from floor to fender well and record
Loosen all four K-frame bolts.
Drilling a small hole into frame rail to insert rust penetrating oil straw
Remove front wheels
Remove the plates that cover the upper control arm fasteners
Support the K-frame from below.
Loosen the tension from torsion bars via the adjustment bolts.
Remove the four upper control arm nuts from bolt/studs
Loosen all eight support bracket to K-frame bolts.
Remove the four bolts and plate on Left side – but don’t remove the Right side, yet
remove the four 4 K-frame bolts.
Lower K-frame down.

The Right side bracket will contact the frame after a certain distance.
Left side rear bushing will slip out – sometimes not. If not, it is time to get out the Sawzall and cut through the bushing and metal insert to remove.

Note alignment will be off so you will need to get car aligned afterwards!

Turn torsion bar bolts back to the number of turns you loosened them to, to get ride height back to an approximate height.

I mean, you can see why I left the alignment and ride height untouched, lifted the car over my head, and just committed to a cutoff wheel like the job only paid an hour, right?

Let me play you the song of my people...


 
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