firm feel fast ratio pitman arm

picklesgarage

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Firmfeel Mopar Suspension and Steering
so i know the ads says they work with and can be used with a stock box, but has anyone done this? is it worth it? i need to replace my box but the ones they offer are out of my range. was hoping this might be a good compromise on improving stock without going bankrupt
 
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Oldiron440

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Don't forget the idler arm as well, they both need to be the same length.
 

Magnum Aspen

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Mopar Action magazine Had an article a few years ago where they lowered the power steering pump pressure to improve steering feel. The article was titled "pump it down". The change was very low cost. The article also mentioned that different year and model cars have different pressure setpoints for the power steering pump. Some research might find you one of these. You might consider looking up this article and considering it. I have not made this change. I did find a copy of the article on line .

Also remember that all parts of a system must work together and that Dodge is known for a wide array of pulleys and brackets which do not always work together; there can be difference between AC and non AC cars also different models even with the same engine.
 

Duke5A

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Fast ratio arms on a stock box, even rebuilt, are going to give a fast wet noodle feel as opposed to a slow wet noodle. Unfortunately the only options I know of to properly tighten the steering up are stupid expensive.

Lessening the pressure from the pump does help and it is relatively cheap. I've attached the article to this post. It doesn't get rid of the slop at the 12 o' clock position on the wheel though.

Replacing the box altogether with a Borgeson unit is the ticket, but you'll have over $800 into it by the time you're done.

Start with the cheap solution and see how it is to your liking.

Thinking out loud...wonder how much it would be to change over to a quick ratio manual box out of an older Mopar. Never driven a manual steering car though...
 

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picklesgarage

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Duke5A buy fast wet noodle you are saying it will turn quicker/faster response but not have the feed back usually associated with good handling? I can't get the file to open right now at work will try again at home. Maybe the combo of both will make for better handling without blowing the budget?
 

Duke5A

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Duke5A buy fast wet noodle you are saying it will turn quicker/faster response but not have the feed back usually associated with good handling? I can't get the file to open right now at work will try again at home. Maybe the combo of both will make for better handling without blowing the budget?

Exactly. Concentrate on firming the steering up before worrying how many turns lock-to-lock of the steering wheel it takes. I forget what the factory steering ratio is, but it isn't horrible.
 

picklesgarage

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wow interesting article. seems fairly simple and worth a shot. maybe i should up the priority of replacing the leaking pump
 

Raff

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Fast ratio arms on a stock box, even rebuilt, are going to give a fast wet noodle feel as opposed to a slow wet noodle. Unfortunately the only options I know of to properly tighten the steering up are stupid expensive.

Lessening the pressure from the pump does help and it is relatively cheap. I've attached the article to this post. It doesn't get rid of the slop at the 12 o' clock position on the wheel though.

Replacing the box altogether with a Borgeson unit is the ticket, but you'll have over $800 into it by the time you're done.

Start with the cheap solution and see how it is to your liking.

Thinking out loud...wonder how much it would be to change over to a quick ratio manual box out of an older Mopar. Never driven a manual steering car though...

I remember reading that article but couldn't find it in my back issues. Thanks for posting.
 

kmccabe56

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Firmfeel Mopar Suspension and Steering
so i know the ads says they work with and can be used with a stock box, but has anyone done this? is it worth it? i need to replace my box but the ones they offer are out of my range. was hoping this might be a good compromise on improving stock without going bankrupt

MOST aftermarket rebuilt steering boxes are crap, to put it mildly. Yes the Firmfeel boxes are pricey, but you get what you pay for. There are a bunch of adjustments you can make to your existing box to tighten it up a bit. If you're not familiar with how to do it, check out a good front end shop. They'll know what to do. As for the fast ratio pittman arm, it's definitely worth it but you absolutely need to change the idler arm at the same time. Changing one without the other is just going to create a giant bowl of NOT GOOD. I've put them in my '79 Aspen wagon and they improve responsiveness and reduce steering wheel angle for every move you'll want to make.
 

picklesgarage

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so finally got the steering done and no longer leaking. ended up just using some reman parts from rock and napa, things haven't been going as planned this year to do much better. I did try the suggestion in the article "pumping it down" that Duke5A posted and it does seem to have some better steering feel. i'm sure if I had been able to use steer and gear or firm feel it would be better but I will take what I can. now just got to straighten out the wheel and one less project to do on it
 

Duke5A

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so finally got the steering done and no longer leaking. ended up just using some reman parts from rock and napa, things haven't been going as planned this year to do much better. I did try the suggestion in the article "pumping it down" that Duke5A posted and it does seem to have some better steering feel. i'm sure if I had been able to use steer and gear or firm feel it would be better but I will take what I can. now just got to straighten out the wheel and one less project to do on it

That's good to hear. How many shims did you end up installing?

The Saginaw pumps are actually GM units and were used in so many different models of cars and trucks. Every model had different requirements for flow (GPM) and pressure (PSI). The parts store rebuilds never gave much of a care as to what valving were used in their builds and sold them without that in mind. You never know what you're getting with a parts store build. They may have pulled a valve from the pile for a GM 2500 truck and stuck in a pump for an M body Chrysler. So you never know what you're starting with.

The shims drop the pressure, but there are fittings that also reduce the flow. I had messed around with both until I had it to where I was happy, and of course the pump started leaking out the front seal. After three parts store pumps over the last couple years all started leaking out the front seal I eventually just ordered a unit from the same place I got my box; which was Borgeson. Of course, from them it came valved to match their box.

20190523_202511.jpg
 

picklesgarage

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surprisingly there were not in it to start. I started with the shim thickness they suggest to start with which is .062. pretty sure the rebuilder had the wrong adaptor on the back since the new hose wouldn't seal with it. its good enough for now, at least I can drive it without leaving a puddle or going thru a quart of fluid every couple days.
 

LSM360

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I have Firmfeels Fast Ratio Pitman Arm and Idler Arm on my AHB. I do like it a lot. I have the stock box, which is in good condition.

FastRatioDip.jpg
 
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