Curses! Blue Permatex on the intake manifold gaskets

Engines, Exhaust and Fuel Systems

  1. ChryslerCruiser

    ChryslerCruiser Active Member

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    Anyone got some suggestions on how to break the seal on someone else's genius idea of using silicone on the intake manifold gaskets??

    AS far as I can tell I have all of the bolts out, and my pry bar wants to bend, rather than pop the intake up.. so I am looking for ideas before I do something that I may regret...

    BTW this is for a first gen 354 hemi but I figured someone here has run across the issue before..

    Thanks ,
    jase
     
  2. Camtron

    Camtron Well-Known Member

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    Some nice thin putty knives and a dead blow hammer work well. Will get between the manifold easily without marring any surfaces. Just work your way around...engine hoist would be handy if you have one. Just Pop it straight off lol
     
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  3. ChryslerCruiser

    ChryslerCruiser Active Member

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    Good to hear, I will have a go with the putty knife. I have one that is fairly thin. No engine hoist, but I can get creative with a bucket tractor if necessary.

    Thanks for the suggestion. I appreciate it!
    Jase
     
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  4. XfbodyX

    XfbodyX Well-Known Member

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    Wooden block and BFH, if you can sacrifice a tiny flat blade serewdriver, find a non intrusive area and hammer it in just to put a hint of tension on it so when you shock it, its already under load.

    Ive also on one stubborn unit got a tiny gap and cut a wedge of wood and each day id give it one whack until on day the intake had broke loose.
    Thinking back to the 331 354 intakes id not pry too much on the outter runners but if your gonna put tension on it id try to do the center area.

    You probably got it off by now, none are really that difficult if all the bolts are out.
     
  5. ChryslerCruiser

    ChryslerCruiser Active Member

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    Nope, Have not even lifted a finger to start.. I appreciate the additional advice, as that gives options rather than just trying harder... which usually breaks stuff.
     
  6. BudW

    BudW Moderator Staff Member

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    I have no suggestions for getting it removed.
    I will say any gaskets that will be remotely close to gasoline – you need to keep silicone sealer a long way away from. Over time, gasoline will dissolve the silicone sealer leaving you with a “gap” which causes bolts to get loose and air leaks.
    BudW
     
  7. Aspen500

    Aspen500 Well-Known Member

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    Especially that old shiny blue crap from 1982.
     
  8. Oldiron440

    Oldiron440 Well-Known Member

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    Or the orange stuff from 1977.
     
  9. ChryslerCruiser

    ChryslerCruiser Active Member

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    I got it off.. Thanks for the suggestions. I eventually used a pry bar lightly, and a plastic mallet.. NOW to get the head off/and out of the engine bay. I determined yesterday that the engine is in fact stuck... so it is coming out for a rebuild..
     
  10. BudW

    BudW Moderator Staff Member

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    Those are always “fun”.
    Start soaking with rust penetrator, now. It would be best of you could have a puddle on top of each piston top – but that doesn’t work very well for all cylinders. The cylinder heads might need the same treatment.

    May I ask what the engine came out of?
    BudW
     
  11. ChryslerCruiser

    ChryslerCruiser Active Member

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    Yes you may! It has not been removed yet from a '59 D900 (former fire truck) and I am scheming on how to remove the cylinder heads with out damaging them, or myself... debating about how to get the engine out while leaving the GIANT 5 speed tranny in place (guessing it is 250-300LBS by the size of it).

    Ive been hitting the cylinders with "Free All" which up until now was amazing at loosening rusted nuts and bolts.. but it does not yet seems to have the magic for pistons.
     
  12. XfbodyX

    XfbodyX Well-Known Member

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    Whats your fear on damaging the heads? Is it an ind. motor with the long clutch housing on the back or a std early hemi?
     
  13. ChryslerCruiser

    ChryslerCruiser Active Member

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    I believe it is a standard early Hemi. Only concern with removing the heads is around dinging the head surface, or something of the like.. I understand they are somewhere around 100lbs, and I am standing on a step stool to reach the engine room... that is to say the crank shaft is probably 2.5-3 feet off the ground... so getting leverage and a firm grasp while up in the air.... actually if I had done this before (removed a head off an engine in a vehicle) then it would probably be a non issue. Mostly inexperience is the cause for concern..
     
  14. BudW

    BudW Moderator Staff Member

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    Those early Hemi engine heads were heavy. Not sure about 100 pounds each – but I can’t dispute that number either. I never got the chance to directly work on one – but I had to move parts around for a few (same for Gen 2 Hemi’s). There is about as much cast iron in a Gen 1 or Gen 2 Hemi head as there is in a 4-cylinder block.

    I’m getting to the age that moving a heavy part in an over-extended position – is not advisable. Example of which is cast iron V8 intake while it is still on the car. Even installing an aluminum V8 intake in car might not be advisable, either. Having a helper makes a huge difference (if possible) or using a cherry picker (or something) might help you in this case.

    I’m wondering why you are not removing the entire engine from vehicle on one assembly.


    It is not easy to damage an iron head – possible, but not easy. If you dropped one, I would be more worried about what the head fell on, than the head itself (like your foot, fender, etc.).

    You have been taking a lot of pictures, like intake bolts, brackets, etc. as well as bagging/tagging your parts?
    Generally, if you are reassembling the engine right away, it is not as big of an issue, but if you are reassembling it, a month, a year (or longer) you will find your memory has forgotten mass amounts of details. A few pictures will go a long way (the more, the better).
    BudW
     
  15. BudW

    BudW Moderator Staff Member

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    I am no expert on the Gen 1 Hemi’s, but I do know there is a deep clutch block (integral bell housing) and a shallow clutch block (normal).

    The deep clutch (integral bell housing) block is longer and not as useful for most people retrofitting the engine to something else. Being this is a standard transmission and a HD truck, I would “assume” it has the longer block.

    I’ve heard that many of the truck 4 and 5-speed manual transmissions are very similar for ‘50’s-‘70’s trucks (1-ton or larger) but most made before 1970ish were not synchronized and pretty much all truck manual transmissions (with exception of the A833-OD) had shifter made into top of transmission (not easy to adapt to a car) and are super heavy.

    If you are looking for a manual transmission, most all the newer pickup transmissions (’90 and newer) will be a much better one to use (better ratios, better parts availability, etc.)
    BudW
     
  16. 80mirada

    80mirada Well-Known Member

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    deep bell housing would be early engines, later engines were shallow. 354 is a late engine, and has a shallow bell housing flange.
     
  17. XfbodyX

    XfbodyX Well-Known Member

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    Thats why I asked if it were an industrial motor, there are still beep bell 354 irrigation motors floating around my area.
     
  18. ChryslerCruiser

    ChryslerCruiser Active Member

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    I believe it is a shallow bell housing. The motor appears to be 'stuck' so pulling the heads to find out more... NOT sure how to pull the tranny as it is a monster, far bigger than 5 speed Getrag 360 behind my 90 DODGE 5.9 diesel.. I think based upon the FSM the tranny may be a Clark 265V or the heavier duty 300? Yes that tranny will not fit in a car, or a 1 ton truck for that matter, as it is too deep, and would almost drag on the ground in a 2 wheel drive ton truck.

    Yes I am taking pictures.. and bagging and labeling as well.. Good advice!
     
  19. BudW

    BudW Moderator Staff Member

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    A Hemi expert (Gen I, II or III), I am not.
    I just know enough to be dangerous.
    BudW
     
  20. Aspen500

    Aspen500 Well-Known Member

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    I'd suggest a cherry picker to lift the heads off, if possible. It also comes down to age. The persons age, not the engine's. lol. At my age, it'd be cherry picker or the heads aren't coming off.:(