Front end squeak: Ball Joint or Torsion Bar Bushing?

[mgbeda]

Hi Folks. My '87 5th Ave is in pretty good shape, with now 128K miles. Ever since I got it 4 years ago the front right of the car squeaks like crazy over any bump, or even getting in and out of the car. A horror-movie-door hinge sound. Makes the car seem a beater even if the rest of it is good.

Here's my question. What are the odds that the squeak is caused by the upper (or lower) ball joint vs. by the torsion bar bushing? The suspension is all original except for new shocks. Replacing the torsion bar bushings seems beyond me, but I think I can do the ball joints (did those once before on a GM). So if it's even a 50/50 chance the ball joint is the problem, I'll give that a shot. On the other hand even the ball joint is kind of a major job for me, so I'd rather not waste my time on a long shot. I've seen plenty of posts here talking about replacement Poly bushings squeaking, but these are original. I don't care if the handling is a little looser than ideal, I just want to stop the squeak.

Thanks,

-mB

 

[Mikes5thAve]

Control arm bushings and sway bar are more likely then ball joints. Torsion bar bushings usually don't squeak. Do a quick visual inspection and get someone to push each corner up and down and it should help pinpoint where it's coming from.

 

[Camtron]

here’s one; is it the upper or lower control arm bushings when you hit a bump?

 

[Camtron]

Control arm bushings and sway bar are more likely than ball joints. Torsion bar bushings usually don't squeak. Do a quick visual inspection and get someone to push each corner up and down and it should help pinpoint where it's coming from.

Dang, beat me and added more, lol

 

[Aspen500]

Get a mechanics stethescope and touch the probe to each bushing and ball joint, while someone pushes the car up and down (I know, easier said than done on the ground). Where it sounds the loudest is the most likely culprit. I say loudest since the noise will travel.

If it is a ball joint, keep in mind they are different on a GM. On Mopar, the lower is pressed in and out of the control arm, the upper is threaded and takes a special socket,,,,,,and a 2 foot breaker bar.

Do the joints have grease fittings? If so, pump some grease in and see if the noise goes away, or at least is diminished. If not, look elsewhere.

It's rare but also check the tie rod ends. I've seen them creak over bumps, but not make a sound when turning the wheel.

I was an auto tech for 40 years, and one of the toughest things to diagnose are suspension noises.

 

[Duke5A]

At 128k I'd be rebuilding the front end regardless of squeaks. If you want to do most of it yourself, but don't want to monkey with the control arm bushings or ball joints just take the arms off and take those to a shop. It's what I did.

 

[Sub03]

I'm guessing a rubber bushing is the culprit rather than ball joint.
If you don't have a partner to help you bounce the front end, you could use a spray lubricant. You lubricate one bushing (torsion, sway bar and upper/lower control arm) at the time, then bounce the car and listen for a change in sound.
Remember petroleum based lubricants are not good for rubber components, so I would go for a silicon spray.

Agree with Duke, a front end close to 40 years old may need a rebuild any way. Will probably improve handling and the overall feel too, it certainly did on my Aspen.

 

[mgbeda]

Thanks a bunch guys!

-mB

 

[LSM360]

I've sprayed lubricant like silicone on upper and lower bushings one at a time to see if squeak stopped so I could identify source. I agree not likely a balljoint AND I agree time to do a front end rebuild.

 

[AHBguru]

Possibly a control arm bushing, but I can almost guarantee it will be one or both of the pivot cushion bushings at the torsion bar (where the torsion bar mounts and pivots at the front of the k-frame). These are notorious for wearing out, and making contact with the k-frame.

Put the car up on ramps, and check for insufficient clearance between the torsion bar and k-frame. There should be plenty of bushing if it's good. Most likely, it'll be very thin or nearly gone. Those must be replaced. If you buy an aftermarket kit, the bushings are split, so you shouldn't have to remove the torsion bar to replace them.

 

[toolmanmike]

It's good to figure out what caused the squeak but the bottom line is that you want the noise gone. Spray all the bushings with silicone or WD-40. Penetrating oil works as well. So does transmission fluid although it's a lot messier than than aerosol lubricants. Bounce the front end and re-apply as needed. You might want to hit the grease zerks with some chassis grease while you are at it.

 

[AHBguru]

It's good to figure out what caused the squeak but the bottom line is that you want the noise gone. Spray all the bushings with silicone or WD-40. Penetrating oil works as well. So does transmission fluid although it's a lot messier than than aerosol lubricants. Bounce the front end and re-apply as needed. You might want to hit the grease zerks with some chassis grease while you are at it.

If the pivot cushion bushings or even torsion bar anchor bushings are bad, they MUST be replaced. That's how you get the noise to go away.

*Failure to to so could result in torsion bar failure or loss of control of the vehicle*

 

[toolmanmike]

If the pivot cushion bushings or even torsion bar anchor bushings are bad, they MUST be replaced. That's how you get the noise to go away.

*Failure to to so could result in torsion bar failure or loss of control of the vehicle*

Ya, no kidding. A thorough front end inspection goes without saying. Well, may be not.

 

[AHBguru]

Ya, no kidding. A thorough front end inspection goes without saying. Well, may be not.

There are a lot of people who don't know a great deal about these old cars. If you don't explain the process, how do you expect anyone to learn anything?