1980 Lebaron; Heart rending

[Shorty Thompson]

You ever run across an all steel drivable car just to add a neutral set eyes to find the holy grail of,,,,, nope! I did this weekend. Priced started out at $4k. Seller dropped it all the way down to $1k. I went looked at it and it was all steel, no bondo, interior wasn't to my liking but wasn't unlivable. 2-door, little door sag on the driver's door, not overall that bad. Passenger side sub frame solid, but when I got to the driver's side rotted bad enough to make me walk the other way. So,,,,,, disheartening.

 

[XfbodyX]

I never understood things like this. You never considered a 3-400 rust free frame rail and if you can not do it pay someone to put it in? Just say someone wanted 1k (just pulling a number) to properly R@R that rail. Youd still be less then the 4k and have a great car.

And thats going to correct route. Many have successfully scabbed in all types of repairs that work for much less.

Unfortunately im cutting up a parts car and yes it has as good as any used frame rails as one can find but they will get cut along with the good floor pan simply because so many just dont want to put the work in. We all do so much to our cars but so many shy from a rail or pan replacement. But as our cars age more and more cars that are nice are going to need a bit more TLC.

Maybe im thinking of a different poster but wasnt it possibly you who wanted the exploded view of a wagon to maybe create something different? A frame rail should be a simple task vs that idea.

Either way if the cars that good for 1k, go get it, buck up and put a rail in it and make it something special.

Just an idea.

 

[M_Body_Coupe]

You know, hard to argue with what XfbodyX said there...$1k is a freaking steal for something in the shape you described above.

My coupe got the AutoRustTech rail-caps on both sides...the PASS was fine, but the DRIVER was not...either way, both got them and what a difference that made...I mean visually the front end no longer sags down as you put it up on some jack stands and remove the jack from under the K-frame.

Even if you need to hire someone to clubber a subframe cap...heck, 4 hrs. of work and it's pretty much done, no?

I say this b/c it took me a day to weld in the sub-frame connectors, and for those I fabricated totally new rear end piece to nicely tuck-in with the frame...and I'm no welding guru..heck, I'm terrible!

 

[Duke5A]

How common is it for these cars just to rot out a single rail? My reservation would be if there is bad enough cancer in one spot it has to be elsewhere too.

 

[Aspen500]

It is more common than you'd think for just the drivers front rail to rot out, while the rest of the car is fine yet.

My theory, and it's only a theory, is battery acid fumes sink down and into the rail. Since acid fumes are heavier than air, they go to the lower parts of the rail and rot it out from the inside. Probably made worse by people running weak batteries that are constantly charging at a high amp rate, which causes more acid fumes. Again, only a theory. One reason I got a battery that uses a vent tube to vent below the car, vs using vented caps with fumes venting in the engine comp.

 

[AMC Diplomat]

It is more common than you'd think for just the drivers front rail to rot out, while the rest of the car is fine yet.

My theory, and it's only a theory, is battery acid fumes sink down and into the rail. Since acid fumes are heavier than air, they go to the lower parts of the rail and rot it out from the inside. Probably made worse by people running weak batteries that are constantly charging at a high amp rate, which causes more acid fumes. Again, only a theory. One reason I got a battery that uses a vent tube to vent below the car, vs using vented caps with fumes venting in the engine comp.

Well now I have something else to be paranoid about. But the a vaguely similar thing happens on the Ford Panther platform. Condensation from the ac system drips down and rots the passenger side frame.

 

[XfbodyX]

That theory has been semi tested over the years. Some e body guys did it like 20 years ago. Next time you have something frozen delivered with dry ice take an ice cube tray with warm water and sit it on your battery and place a few small chips of dry ice in each corner. Then watch where the fog goes and forms. Its very enlightening.

One can also take a pint of new thin ATF and simulate a pour that would come out of each side of the cowl drain flap and then go back the next day and take a look. Thats interesting also. The frame rails are like a giant open trough then right at the firewall they are like a giant covered trough.... what could go wrong?

Also when the cowl gets plugged and pin holes form and water drains into the floor pan and then when it gets pin holes over that section of the frame rail and seeps into the back part of the frame rail, well.

The one common factor is water/moisture and semi well known is the area on the pass side where the Y pipe runs close to the frame. Heat cycles at certain times also cause moisture on the inside and at times thats the only bad spot on a nice car if not in a semi arid or arid environment.

The inside of the frame rails got no less or any more protection from the dipping process then any other part of the car and so what was the lifespan of a car in 1978?

So its not shocking at all that frame rails rust out. Sorta a surprise more are not and its not just a fmj thing as its everything. Were only trying to get 50 years out of a 5 year car. But none of this is new news blah blah blah.

 

[Mikes5thAve]

I don't know about the battery part because there is is lots of parts closer that would be affected by it and other cars, or even later Ms don't have the problem, but it is strange that the driver side is most common. My 79 rusted out on that side also.
Oddly enough the way the front fame rails are made and trap dirt up top that doesn't necesserily rust them out but does rust out the fuel lines on the passenger side is similar to how the newer LXs were made. And just like the older I cleaned a ton of stuff out of my Charger there.

 

[Aspen500]

Why the left rail rusts out, the world may never know. However, it can be repaired, same as any other rust.

 

[GaryKoz]

Keep in mind, cars that are primarily driven by a single person (work car, not married, etc) and seldom have someone in the passenger seat, will also contribute to the problem.
Here in the midwest, people get into their cars with wet salty slush on their shoes/boots. Then go driving around as their feet grind that toxic, cancer-causing mixture into the car's carpet.
Where (in those months), it don't dry.
Ever.

So if a car only has one occupant, there's only one side of the car being exposed to this process.

 

[Aspen500]

I had forgotten about that. Many times I've seen cars with the drivers floor almost completely rusted away, while the rest of the floor pan looks darn near new yet.