1978 E58 Engine w/125 mph Speedo?

F Body General Discussion

  1. Sgt Superbird

    Sgt Superbird Member

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    Is there anyone out there that knows of a 1978 F body, with the 360-4 (E58), NON cop car, that came from the factory with a 125 mph "certified" police speedometer, or did EVERY non-cop E58 come with the standard speedo?
     
  2. XfbodyX

    XfbodyX Well-Known Member

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    You question is a little open ended, shouldnt you be asking if anyone ever seen one in a SC or Kit car and can prove it? Some can say maybe, some can say they seen one, alot can happen in 40 years, Jimmy John with a new SC could go down a week after buying a SC and have the dealer swap in a 125 certi speedo.

    But back to your direct question, it looks good in a sales ad but short of a order sheet or build sheet, or dealer docs its pure speculation.

    Any 40 year old car has lots of cool stories behind them but just like fishing, with time that 8 in perch uncle jimmy john caught is now a 32 inch northen pike.

    More so id not think just a speedo alone would of made it, the addition of the cop car code on the tag would of gotten the speedo, oil pressure gauge, the same t bars but with the better ends, ect, oil cooler. I myself dont see how you could pick part of an option package. And again, it all comes back to documentation vs speculation and "I recall".

    Yes , my SC has a 125 certified speedo and the cop op unit, because I put it in.
     
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2019
  3. Sgt Superbird

    Sgt Superbird Member

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    I might not have been clear in my request. Yes, this was about proof, just not "have you seen one". I've seen one - and am looking into it. Sorry for the confusion, and thanks for the reply.
     
  4. XfbodyX

    XfbodyX Well-Known Member

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    Did you ask for a fender tag pic of this car?
     
  5. Sgt Superbird

    Sgt Superbird Member

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    I have it. Nothing sticks out. A43, A53, E58, built May 5. I can send it to you.
     
  6. Aspen500

    Aspen500 Well-Known Member

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    I can't say 100% for sure BUT, I've never seen a "certified" speedo in any non-police pkg car that was original. I'm talking Mopar, Ford and Chevy so,,,,,,,,,if I had to make a call, I'd say the answer would be no.
    Now for the disclaimer. I've learned when it comes to cars, especially Mopar you can never say never. Certain cars were "never built" and that's the consensus for 40 years or something and then,,,,,,,,,one will turn up with documentation to prove it or, the car was just plain built wrong, which is tough to prove as fact because any documentation won't match. My dad's '62 Fury is one of those. He bought it new and he and I know it was built the way it is but it has some Sport Fury pieces it's "not supposed to have" because it's a plain Fury 2 dr hdtp. An example of a car they never built that way.
     
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  7. Sgt Superbird

    Sgt Superbird Member

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    I agree with both your points! Thanks for your response.
     
  8. BudW

    BudW Moderator Staff Member

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    I’ve heard of policemen purchasing a “special” car for personal usage that might be of police specifications – but most, if not all, official police cars were purchased direct from Chrysler via a bid/letting process (or at least until I got out of the dealership – not sure about today).
    Chrysler would ship the cars to a dealership close to the police dept. for final make ready, then advise so cars could be picked up.

    I remember more than a few times; the car haulers would arrive and we (the dealership) didn’t even know the cars were coming. It is no fun having three trucks deliver cars/trucks to point lot is full, then having five more trucks delivering police cars and nowhere to put ‘em all.

    I would agree with @Aspen500. I can’t picture any non-police car coming with a Certified speedometer from factory. A dealership could install one after purchase or anyone could come off the street and order a new speedometer.
    A broadcast sheet would be helpful – but I doubt any non-police cars would have been built with a certified speedometer.
    BudW
     
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  9. Aspen500

    Aspen500 Well-Known Member

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    Kind of off topic but,,,,,,,,,I wonder what "Certified" really means? If you check speedometer error, it's no different than any other vehicle. Usually actual speed is indicated as +/- 2 to 4 mph, which is normal speedo tolerance. An actual 65 could be shown as 62, 65, 68 ,etc...... New tires vs worn tires or summer tires vs winter tires will cause the error to change so there's no way they could ever be dead nuts perfectly accurate at every speed. Just an observation I made over the 21 years I worked as a Ford dealer tech (1986 through 2007) and that included many squad cars, local, county and state. Certified what?
     
  10. kkritsilas

    kkritsilas Well-Known Member

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    Certified just means that there is a known tolerance in most cases. Certification would consist of spinning the input/transmission/speedo cable at some rpm, and then verifying that the speedometer reads the MPH in an acceptable band. I don't know that any speedometer would be perfect, except possibly the GPS speedometers from Speedhut, and even they have some tolerance built in. That tolerance should be lower than a standard speedometer (mechanical or electronic) because it really doesn't depend on tire diameter or slippage, rear end/transmission gear ratios, or the other factors that impact the accuracy of standard speedometers.
     
  11. Ele115

    Ele115 Well-Known Member

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    There used to be (take with a grain of salt) speedometer techs in some police department shops that calibrated speedometers at certain intervals and put a decal on the dash showing the error at speeds. Detroit and several Arizona and Nevada cities I am 100% sure of via first hand. These hand to stand up in court when tickets were written based on "pacing". I am not aware of any organized police speedometer calibration operations more recent than mid 1980's. Taking speedometers apart, I am not sure how they "adjusted" them, but I am NOT an expert so maybe they adjusted at the transmission or something.
     
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  12. BudW

    BudW Moderator Staff Member

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    Mechanical speedometers are odd on how they work (at first). There is a non-scientific method to adjust them (it is more like lots of trial and error).

    On one end you have a loop with two magnets on it. On the other end you have a “C” shaped piece of metal that goes inside of the loop. As the loop spins, magnetic force of magnets causes the steel “C” to move. Keep in mind the “C” has a spring on it to keep it from spinning.
    Speedo Op.png
    The way to adjust the speedometer is to increase (or decrease) the distance the “C” fingers are from magnets in very small adjustments and/or adjust the spring tension.

    There are two bushings, one for each shaft. If those bushings wear (ie: high mileage cars), the rotating end will rotate off center – which will make the “C” finger closer to magnets - the point the needle will jump all over the place – which is currently occurring on my wagon.

    Speedometer shops have an electric motor that can operate at three speeds. I think 30, 60 and 100 MPH. They connect a "known speed" to speedometer head and keep adjusting until all three speeds read at 0.1% for certification or 1% (or so) for everyone else.

    I have no question that certified speedometers are correct. My question is how good the officer’s eyes are at the time (which can be conflicting to comment about when you are the recipient of the ticket).
    BudW
     
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  13. Sgt Superbird

    Sgt Superbird Member

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    I was reading up on the whole idea of a "certified" speedometer, and if this is true, they had to be officially certified every 1,000 miles, if used for pacing purposes. To think of removing the item this often for adjustment, makes my head ache! I can't see it done any other way than on a bench, unless there's some trick to it.
     
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  14. Ele115

    Ele115 Well-Known Member

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    They were fairly accurate to within a few MPH, then the offending party was "given" 2-3 mph to account for error. But the whole thing about calibration every 6 months (Reno) sounds pretty much like a scam to me. It's like downloading blank paper. Someone was sitting in a shop somewhere getting paid to do a bunch of speedometers and they were probably doing only 3% of them and issuing stickers for 100%. Municipal employment. "Let's get through all these and take a long lunch under a big shade tree".
     
  15. BudW

    BudW Moderator Staff Member

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    I can’t see every 6 months.
    I can see maybe every 3-5 years . . . Maybe – which about the time the police departments (at the time) was replacing the cars (in Tulsa and Wagner countys, Oklahoma).
    BudW
     
  16. MoPar Maniac

    MoPar Maniac New Member

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    If they ran out of the regular speedos at the factory they won't hold up production if they have any cop speedos in stock.
     
  17. BudW

    BudW Moderator Staff Member

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    I would agree with that statement.
     
  18. XfbodyX

    XfbodyX Well-Known Member

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    In the big picture id think it would be very unlikely. One a pure specialty car, the other a semi specialty car, one a two door, one a 4 door, more then not made at different plants comes easily to mind.

    Id expect it so much more probable on a "line"car if even that.
     
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  19. Sgt Superbird

    Sgt Superbird Member

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    It's funny how so many of these posts go off in different directions. I guess that's the fun of a thread on a forum! Anyway, above is my original post. So, the answer still is "no". Nobody has come forward with proof or "I knew of one..." There was a reason for my original post, and XfbodyX has been a wealth of information and a gigantic help to settle the issue.
     
  20. Aspen500

    Aspen500 Well-Known Member

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    What does XfbodyX know about Aspen's and Volare's? Basically, he's probably forgotten more about them than I've ever known in total! :cool: I'm serious about that.