small block 4bbl intake

[alf44]

im looking for a 318 4 bbl intake ,used, at a reasonable price. dont need to look pretty just needs to be in good shape. the engine is a 85 318 2bbl leanburn now and wanting to go to a 4 bbl. im thinking on using a holley economaster 4bbl carb so i need a intake that this carb would fit-- mounting flange style the same as holley.. if you have 1 plz send me a pm... thanks alot.,.,.,. alan

 

[Erics5th]

If all you can find is a spread bore manifold, you can always just get an adapter plate. I use a Performer with a 1406 (a square bore). I used to have a Holley 4130 as well. Is that what you have? When I bought my 5th, my friend put a SP2P manifold on it with the Holley. Edelbrock doesn't make that manifold anymore, they come up on Ebay every once in a while. Great for low end torque with the smaller runners, but run out of breath at the high end. I was able to do 100 with it on, but the Performer is a better all around manifold... much better response over the SP2P.

 

[alf44]

dont have any 4bbl parts yet, still window shopping

 

[NoCar340]

The only intakes that come to mind with a square-bore configuration from the factory are the '66-'67 273-4V and the '68-'70 340. The '64-'65 intakes use an intake that only fits '64-'65 273 heads because of the bolt-hole angle.

If you have AC, you're stuck with a factory iron manifold or an Edelbrock Performer. Of the two, the factory iron piece actually makes more horsepower and torque; just at a little higher RPM than the Eddy piece. They're easy to find in 360 pickups; it's the same top end they used on the 318-4V '81-'89 including the heads. The StreetMaster/SP2P is scrap aluminum that should be used as a last resort.

Made a lot of money years ago selling 360 truck intakes as "rare" date-coded A38/AHB intakes. :eusa_dance:

 

[alf44]

will be running no ac. all of it was taken out before i bought car. i would take a good used factory iron intake with a square bore if i find one

 

[NoCar340]

I would suggest finding one locally or at a swap meet. They're rather expensive to ship. :eusa_doh:

Expect to pay dearly for a factory square-bore intake. Everything '71-newer is spread bore. If memory serves, you'd still need an adapter to run the Holley, and if you're going to run an Edeljunk make sure you get one with the dual bolt patterns drilled. All the OE square-bore intakes use the narrower early Carter bolt pattern.

 

[My imp]

Pro Comp sells their version of an Air-Gap dual-plane, square bore manifold for $169 new on ebay. It'd cost a small fortune to ship a factory iron manifold. You can pick up used aluminum ones for the cost of shipping an iron one.

 

[NoCar340]

Yep. Depending on distance, you could pay close to 3-digit shipping.

 

[ramenth]

The only intakes that come to mind with a square-bore configuration from the factory are the '66-'67 273-4V and the '68-'70 340. The '64-'65 intakes use an intake that only fits '64-'65 273 heads because of the bolt-hole angle.

If you have AC, you're stuck with a factory iron manifold or an Edelbrock Performer. Of the two, the factory iron piece actually makes more horsepower and torque; just at a little higher RPM than the Eddy piece. They're easy to find in 360 pickups; it's the same top end they used on the 318-4V '81-'89 including the heads. The StreetMaster/SP2P is scrap aluminum that should be used as a last resort.

Made a lot of money years ago selling 360 truck intakes as "rare" date-coded A38/AHB intakes. :eusa_dance:

I would suggest finding one locally or at a swap meet. They're rather expensive to ship. :eusa_doh:

Expect to pay dearly for a factory square-bore intake. Everything '71-newer is spread bore. If memory serves, you'd still need an adapter to run the Holley, and if you're going to run an Edeljunk make sure you get one with the dual bolt patterns drilled. All the OE square-bore intakes use the narrower early Carter bolt pattern.

Okay, I gotta chime in here, not for any advice, but to give NoCar props for not buying to the Edelbrock hype. On one of our sister sites if you're not using an Edelbrock intake then your engine just flat out won't run! HA!

 

[NoCar340]

Funny things happen in your brain when you work around a dyno cell and stop reading magazines, especially Primedia magazines (like Mopar Muscle).

 

[My imp]

You keep anything from Edelbrock! Overpriced, patriotic hype bullshite! We'd all like to run American. We'd all like to be able to justify running American! These FAST cars sure run great w/o Eddy products! He makes his money by exploiting the non-SBC, SBF owners. If he's worried about R/D, do like GM, wait 30 yrs, then copy Mopar! They claim the prices are higher because they don't sell as many. We won't buy it because it costs too much. His heads don't flow as well as Pro Comp heads, he has warranty problems also. It's all in who runs the machine. These other companies wouldn't be gaining market share if their products are junk. Word gets around! Everyone has problems in the beginning. After the teething pains are over, the good companies tend to stay around, if they don't overextend. If it comes on a car I buy, I won't take it off, but I won't purchase anything & put it on either. Do you care if it's single or dual plane?

 

[NoCar340]

YDo you care if it's single or dual plane?

I do. Dual-planes are for trucks. I don't own a truck. :icon_wink:

 

[ramenth]

I do. Dual-planes are for trucks. I don't own a truck. :icon_wink:

Oh, wow! Score!

No seriously, one of our sister sites everyone insists that Edelbrock is the only way to go and anything run on the street must be a dual plane!

The 360 in the Diplomat runs pretty damn good after all these years for doing it wrong! HA!

 

[NoCar340]

Apparently you missed my intake setup in the "Imperial EFI..." thread I started in the Engines area.

 

[ramenth]

Apparently you missed my intake setup in the "Imperial EFI..." thread I started in the Engines area.

Yeah, I did. Just went and looked it up.

And apparently you have been listening to the ages old tripe that's being regurgitated by a lot of people. :icon_thumright:

 

[NoCar340]

Yeah, listening and laughing.

I could go on about it for hours... so much that is accepted as "fact" just isn't true. A lot of money gets spent buying things that simply are not necessary, and in a lot of cases hurt performance.

As my final word on the Edelbrock stuff: the only thing they make that's worth a damn, in my opinion, is the Performer RPM Air Gap intake. That really does work well for a dual-plane. There used to be an overseas "Crosswind" copy of it, but that seems to have gone away. I don't know that any magazine ever did a side-by-side dyno session with one v. the other. I wonder how well it might have fared.

 

[My imp]

Pro comp's is a dual plane, air gap manifold. Are people (you notice I didn't call them journalists) even allowed to print the truth with any regard to the truth vs. whose product they're trying to push? Dig out some of your old Hot Rod, Mopar mag.'s, etc. from the '70's or '80's. Just read what used to be printed when people still had a tad of integrity. The ad's used to be between the articles. Now, they ARE the articles. Just like TV.

 

[ramenth]

Pro comp's is a dual plane, air gap manifold. Are people (you notice I didn't call them journalists) even allowed to print the truth with any regard to the truth vs. whose product they're trying to push? Dig out some of your old Hot Rod, Mopar mag.'s, etc. from the '70's or '80's. Just read what used to be printed when people still had a tad of integrity. The ad's used to be between the articles. Now, they ARE the articles. Just like TV.

And that's the problem. A lot of the side by side comparisons done are for the sake of advertising. Vendor A supplies the intakes to be compared. In all scenarios Vendor A wins.

Take Ehrenberg's write up on the engine build for his '69 Road Runner. They went with Edelbrock heads and intake, got xxx amount of horsepower and torque. Indy sent him a set of EZ's and an intake to try. There's pics in the mag which show him bolting them on, yet he never returned to the engine for a comparison before he went on to building the suspension. Considering Indy is a major advertiser in the mag makes you wonder if they ignored the comparison because certain people might get pissed off. He even made the comment in one of the articles in a bookshelf comparison... the Edelbrock intake was a single plane, the intake Indy sent him was a dual plane. "Well, it'll certainly make more torque..."

What kills me is because of the myths being spread on the interweb is so many people are willing to dismiss a superior intake off hand because it's being said over and over again... "single planes don't work on the street." People go to the forums and throw out an engine build and then they let someone who he or she considers more knowledgeable do a bench build and take it as gospel instead of sitting and doing his or her own research.

I don't know how many times this has been typed over the years, but when someone steps up and say, "wait a minute! I run a single plane on the street," he is all but ignored - or even derided - because his real world experience doesn't fit with the internet myth. There's no real world first hand experience coming from the naysayers, just the old fall back of "if it worked, then the manufacturers would use 'em!"

 

[NoCar340]

The 273 & early LA318 2V intakes were single-plane :icon_wink:, as is virtually every MPFI intake used today. Some of the TBI intakes were dual-plane, but the manufacturers have to plan for every contingency. People towing, etc. with vehicles never designed to do such things. Even Tom Hoover admitted the 426 Street Hemi should've been a single four-barrel with a single-plane intake; it would've been faster. What's funny about you mentioning E-berg is that he's generally of the same school of thought about intakes, so he may have dismissed the Indy piece out-of-hand.

As I said, the Performer RPM Air Gap is a good piece. I have a local friend who's knocking on the 10s with one (best of 11.03) on an all-iron 340 with X heads in an all-steel (except hood) Duster. He knows he could probably go faster with a Holley Strip Dominator or Mopar M1 single-plane, but he's having too much fun pounding big-block Camaros with the dual-plane in place. They freak out when they see that style of intake. The Pro Comp piece may be every bit as good, even better... but do you think any magazine will seriously test it and risk Vic's advertising dollars? I think not.

 

[My imp]

Exactly my point Robert. There are so many combos out there. Some work, some don't. All these "experts" that graduated from Hot Rod Magazine U. will show you the latest ad, I mean article on how engines should be built. Hands down, that's the only combo that works. The best example I can think of , is when I lived in Fl. Two of my co-workers (both mechanics, one was a line mech. for 18yrs at a Chrysler dealer) wanted to build their 318's. The 1st was a long bed 2wd with 85,000 mi, the 2nd short bed 4wd with under 50,000 mi. Owner #2 worked for Chrysler. When I told them what I'd do, #2 told my I was full of sh*t, & had an article that Arrow Engineering had built a 318 with a certain parts list. Talked to them on the phone, & when asked how they lowered the compression ratio by putting heads with a smaller combustion chamber on, we were told by milling the heads???WTF?? I asked to talk to who actually builds the engines, thinking I must be talking to the floor sweeper, or something. He said he personally built that engine! Thanked him, hung up, explained that this guy DEFINITALY didn't know WTF he was talking about. Owner #1 built his engine the way I recommended. Owner #2 built his exactly the way they did in the article. Owner 1's truck ran excellent. Every parameter set down was met, or exceeded. Owner 2's truck fell on its face. Wrong heads, wrong cam, wrong carb, wrong setup! I almost felt sorry for him. Those TV combo's don't come cheap! Research everything you do. On the interweb, you ask a question, & get 10 different answers. How do you sort them out? I've fallen prey to listening to people I thought knew what they were talking about. I would LOVE to get the 440 upper end setup from ProComp! Heads, single plane (with bosses for EFI!) manifold, valley pan, offset rockers, bolt or stud kit! Next year, right after I build my garage! lol