1987 Chyrsler 5th Avenue - Exterior Trim

[Justwondering]

Inherited my mother-in-law's 1987 Chrysler Fifth Avenue - 39k mileage.
It needed a new headliner and vinyl landau but was otherwise cherry.

Until ...
A tall Silverado truck backed into the front end with the trailer hitch hitting the left front.
Broke up the light assembly, crushed the header panel, and left front fender.

http://www.forfmjbodiesonly.com/classicmopar/vbpicgallery.php?do=view&g=374

Took a couple of years, but I found a same year, color Fifth Avenue at Pick n Pull and removed the parts I needed.

This is my first try at body work, but finally figured out out to get the old parts off and the new ones on. Still needs a few fine alignment adjustments, but its looking pretty good, IMHO.

My current issue is recovering the landau roof and reupholstering the headliner and interior trim.

I have the new vinyl.
I have removed most of the interior trim (waiting on the rear pieces for the weather to cool off before I remove the seat).

I started removing the exterior garnish trim, but I need guidance (please).

I have read and re-read the service manual and studied the drawings, but I still don't get it. Is most of it on the rear door just pressure nuts and I need to just pry them off or is there something else holding that part of the vinyl (with the small emblem)?

Thanks in advance.

 

[Justwondering]

Here are the pictures of my problem area:

this is the outside (oooohhh so attractive) Am trying to get the 'triangle' off. I have bumped the top bracket off the drip rail. I have removed the one screw from the inside-bottom right, in this picture. I have removed the bottom trim (breaking one of the pressure nuts in the process).. but need some reassurance that there are just clips and no screws.

This is the inside.

 

[lowbudget]

IIRC looking at mine there were 2 small pop rivets on the outside bottom that would need to be drilled out to remove the wing.

 

[gray07]

I have blue wing panels and the door chrome forsale

 

[Justwondering]

I have struggled for a week to get the rear seat cushion out of my 1987 Fifth Avenue so I could remove the remaining trim to get to the headliner.
The Service manual pictures and description make it seem crystal clear; however, I found the following video to be of greater help

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Vd2gkefPWA

The two key problems for me were:

1. The amount of rust on the clips on the bottom of the seat and the hooks. Plenty of rocking it left and right, front and back and as much side to side as I could to get the adhesion broken.
.
2. The directions were push down and back, then up. What worked better for me was push down and up at an angle as you are pushing back. The difference would be down and back is 90 degree change of direction. Down, back & up is more like a 45 degree change of direction.

This video was very helpful... many thanks to my husband for finding it for me!

 

[Jack Meoff]

Some are easy and some are a total pain.
My Caravelle rear seat comes out like a breeze.
My Fifth.....not so much.

 

[lowbudget]

So did you get the wing off? When you have it off you might want to fix the opera lights like in this thread. http://www.forfmjbodiesonly.com/classicmopar/showthread.php?3431-Opera-lamp-electroluminescent-EL-strip-replacement-procedures-1988-5th-Ave I did mine and it was easy.

 

[Justwondering]

I did get the wings off. Am currently, tediously, removing aged foam and headliner material from all the interior trim pieces.

I was going to go down the EL Tape route and replace my opera lights; but, there seems to be some changes in LED ultra thin, double density strips as well as LED tape that looks interesting. I was going to put a white diffuser between it and the lens to tone down the 'bright white' but noticed both my lens inserts are cracked.

So I am headed to visit pick n pull tomorrow afternoon to see if the opera lens are still in the body of the car I harvested my front end and left quarter panel.

Unless someone has an extra set... or perhaps I can figure out how to make some from stacking plexiglass.

Did you buy your EL Tape from glow hut?

 

[lowbudget]

Yes the glow hut. As was mentioned in that thread the white has a bluish glow to it. I thought about going red, in fact I have the red strips in the trunk, but I chickened out because I did not know if it would be legal or not. They do look cool at night though! I think mine were cracked or crazed but IIRC you don't really see it when they are on. It might have been the original tape that was crazed. I'd go look at my car but I'm at work for another 17 days.

 

[lowbudget]

Oh are you going to attempt to do your vinyl top yourself? I got the new vinyl last days off and haven't decided if I am going to do it myself or farm it out. The guy I dealt with at Kee told me to use landau foam to pad it, if I was going to do it myself.

 

[Justwondering]

Great minds!
I got my vinyl from Kee auto as well. Worked with a guy named Dave. He was super helpful, sent 7 samples to me so I could figure out which looked best and worked in my budget.

I didn't get foam from Kee. I agree you need to put foam on before you put the vinyl on; however, I had about a yard of closed cell foam which is 3/8 inch thick somebody used as packing material for a large item I ordered. Only one little scuff place in it so it will be used. The important thing is to be closed cell. As I understand it, that means it covers a multitude of sins and imperfections on the fiberglass so they don't telegraph to the vinyl but also sheds water easily. No holes or gaps for the water to gather in should the vinyl get compromised or nicked. And yes, that is the full extent of my knowledge about putting on a vinyl roof.

I did purchase a gallon of contact cement rather than the spray cans. Seemed much cheaper since I have to do all the trim as well as the headliner and the vinyl top.

I want to finalize the opera light issue before I put on the vinyl. Yes, I am doing it myself. No, I haven't done it before. I'll decide on my lights this week and order them. Which puts me at another week to get all cleaning done for the trim/headliner and all that reinstalled.

My thought was to have the vinyl on before I install the new headliner so I don't have to take the garnish molding off the roof but one time.

Spent 4 hours on the trim and headliner this morning cleaning it and am still not done. I swear there were two different people putting the foam on this trim. One used way too much adhesive and the other used barely enough.

If you were working on the Texas coast I would guess you worked on the deep sea oil rigs-- 17 days of work...

 

[Jack Meoff]

I've never attempted one of these roofs myself. Any pics of the transplant would be greatly appreciated.

 

[lowbudget]

I'm working on a drilling rig in Kuwait...on land. How thick was the old foam on yours? Here is a cool how to......I just hope they don't kick me off of the site for posting a link to a Ferd site. http://www.fordmuscleforums.com/body-paint-articles/492176-70s-landau-top-install.html I found I gallon of that adhesive I figured on ordering if I do it. I can use the same stuff to glue the foam to my Aspen seat vinyl before I pleat it. I emailed off to the shop I was told that did vinyl tops out in Salt Lake for a bid. If their price scares me I will do it myself.

 

[Justwondering]

Prepping for New Vinyl Roof on Landau

Topside before I remove garnish molding

Bottomside before I remove garnish molding (headliner has been removed)

There are these funky clips with threaded shanks that fit to the underside of the molding and drop through the holes in the roof

Funky clips on the left picture that got left behind when I pulled the molding. (edit: these are know by several terms - Moulding retainers, Molding retainers, Molding clips)
Notice there is a plastic rectangle at the end of the molding-- there was one above each door. One stuck to the molding, one stuck to the body of the car.

(edit: here is a link to a diagram providing names and part numbers for the moldings: http://www.oemautopartsandaccessori...-avenue-1985/vtec/74933/pid/9b42e291ee2cbb30/ This link has a little more info: http://www.factorychryslerparts.com/showAssembly.aspx?ukey_assembly=663917 )

There were speed nuts (edit: not a speed nut. Haven't figured out what it is called just yet, but the shade-tree mechanics I've talked to have called it either a pressure nut or a speed nut - I don't think either term is correct. I think its probably a Push-type Retainer, but I haven't found them yet. I suppose I could get a round top one and slice the edges off so it would sit in the trim channel.) on the chrome molding at the bottom of the laundau roof bonnet.

They are the white screw shank here. They actually ride in the channel on the underside of the chrome. Pry gently along the length, start over again and pry a little more all along the length, again and again and they will come loose without busting. Except for the one I rushed, and it broke off.

I used a putty knife and stuck it between the bonnet and the glass, then a sharp razor blade (carpet knife) to cut the vinyl even with the bonnet. I cut the vinyl against the metal putty knife blade so I wouldn't damage the glass.
Will add that picture tomorrow.

Gotchas?
Other than breaking the speed nut.
I had two nuts that were a pain to remove due to location. In this picture the nut is in the hole at the top of the picture to the right of the hanging electrical. Yes, that is a red gas can in the background, gives it a little ambiance.

And here is a closeup inside the hole:

And yes, I dropped one nut in the channel so am looking for my magnet to see if I can encourage it to appear. Dang it.

Last gotcha, if you look closely there is the remains of a busted stud at the bottom back corner of the roof bonnet. This holds the short chrome piece immediately above the wheel. This chrome piece has to come off first before the long piece in the back can be removed. Anyhow, the gotcha is that the chrome piece has 1 speed nut which pries off and one stud which looks like it was glued in-- the corner little grey circle nearly in the middle of the picture. If you remove the chrome, you will break this off. At least on my car, it was glued in on both sides. Figure I'll just add another speed nut and drill out the grey stub.

I have to unload 150 bales of hay tomorrow, and we might have rain on Wednesday so no more progress til Thursday. Enjoy the pics if this is new territory (lowbudget) and my apologies at unintended insults to those professional vinyl installers on the forum.

 

[Darth-Car]

Keep the faith. You are making progress.

 

[lowbudget]

Topside before I remove garnish molding View attachment 11093

Bottomside before I remove garnish molding (headliner has been removed)View attachment 11094

There are these funky clips with threaded shanks that fit to the underside of the molding and drop through the holes in the roof
View attachment 11096View attachment 11095Funky clips on the left picture that got left behind when I pulled the molding.
Notice there is a plastic rectangle at the end of the molding-- there was one above each door. One stuck to the molding, one stuck to the body of the car.

There were speed nuts on the chrome molding at the bottom of the laundau roof bonnet. They are the white screw shank here. They actually ride in the channel on the underside of the chrome. Pry gently along the length, start over again and pry a little more all along the length, again and again and they will come loose without busting. Except for the one I rushed, and it broke off.
View attachment 11097View attachment 11098
I used a putty knife and stuck it between the bonnet and the glass, then a sharp razor blade (carpet knife) to cut the vinyl even with the bonnet. I cut the vinyl against the metal putty knife blade so I wouldn't damage the glass.
Will add that picture tomorrow.

Gotchas?
Other than breaking the speed nut.
I had two nuts that were a pain to remove due to location. In this picture the nut is in the hole at the top of the picture to the right of the hanging electrical. Yes, that is a red gas can in the background, gives it a little ambiance.
View attachment 11099 And here is a closeup inside the hole:View attachment 11100

And yes, I dropped one nut in the channel so am looking for my magnet to see if I can encourage it to appear. Dang it.

View attachment 11101 Last gotcha, if you look closely there is the remains of a busted stud at the bottom back corner of the roof bonnet. This holds the short chrome piece immediately above the wheel. This chrome piece has to come off first before the long piece in the back can be removed. Anyhow, the gotcha is that the chrome piece has 1 speed nut which pries off and one stud which looks like it was glued in-- the corner little grey circle nearly in the middle of the picture. If you remove the chrome, you will break this off. At least on my car, it was glued in on both sides. Figure I'll just add another speed nut and drill out the grey stub.

I have to unload 150 bales of hay tomorrow, and we might have rain on Wednesday so no more progress til Thursday. Enjoy the pics if this is new territory (lowbudget) and my apologies at unintended insults to those professional vinyl installers on the forum.

Thanks for the pictures! The upholstery guy never e mailed back so it looks like I will be doing this also days off. Keep at it!

 

[Jack Meoff]

Yes. Thanks for the pics.
I'll be tackling this in the future myself.
This is VERY helpful.

 

[Justwondering]

EL Strips have been ordered from GlowHut and should be here by the end of the week.
To cut down on heat gain from the roof (Texas summers), I ordered radiant barrier from Home Despot (http://www.homedepot.com/p/UltraTouch-48-in-x-24-ft-Radiant-Barrier-30000-11424/100661257) last week and it just arrived. Got this because it was most similar to what the mice/rats removed and rearranged in the car while it was sitting up. So I can use it to replace what was compromised in the sides as well as enough to put across the roof prior to installing the headliner. Cost was certainly more friendly than Dynamat.

FYI: I added a few edits and links to the original pictures of the roof removal to clarify details.

 

[Justwondering]

A few pictures from today.

These are the rivit type, nylon retainers that ride in the backside channel of the lower window chrome trim also known as the belt trim.

A comparison of the original (black) closed cell foam backing under the original vinyl and the new white closed cell foam I will be using. It looks to be about 1/16 or perhaps 1/8 inch narrower but the price was free so the money I save will go a long way to pay for the glowhut lights I ordered to re-light the opera lights.

Both foams feel similar but the black, original foam is much softer no doubt because it is 30+ years older than the foam I most recently acquired.

And the last thing I did this evening is audition the new vinyl I got in from Kee Auto Tops. It needs to sit in the sun for a few days so the wrinkles can straighten out. If that doesn't work, then I'll break out the iron and ironing board (please let the sun's heat work--puh leeze)

The new vinyl has plenty of extra. Easily 4 inches on each edge. Notice that the back doesn't have the window cut out and that the side has the extra long portion. I'm guessing that they use one pattern for 5th avenues and newyorkers, so this pattern would accommodate the rear window trim change during the late 80/early 90 years.

If anyone finds a source for the trim retainers, rivet material nylon; let me know. I think I can get round headed nylon retainers so I may try them and just cut the tops to be retectangular.

 

[lowbudget]

Your attachments didn't show up for me. I read to use steam the get the wrinkles out. I have a couple steamers I bought from the second hand shop for such an occasion.