1. shadango

    shadango Well-Known Member

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    Found a small hole and some thinning area on the frame on my son's 80 Volare 2 door....driver's side front, just as it goes horizontal again after coming down from the front end.....a hole about the size of a quarter on the outside side of the frame. Above and behind that area the frame is solid as far as I can see.

    When we bought the car a few years back that area was starting to show some thinning but hadnt seen a hole.

    Before we start cutting it out and patching in new steel, does anyone know if they make a repair section for this area that can be grafted OVER the whole section?
     
  2. volare 77

    volare 77 Well-Known Member

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    You are better off cutting it out and welding in a new piece. Nobody makes that section that i know of. One company was making some t caps for mopars but has since stopped selling them. They were barely usable(poor quality) from what I had read about them.Also, If you cut a opening it will give you a chance to clean it out and treat the inside so it doesn`t continue to rust from the inside out. Water sits in the frame rails after they get clogged with debris.
     
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  3. shadango

    shadango Well-Known Member

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    That's what I was thinking too....thoguh i was hoping for maybe some pre-made parts that I could use pieces from as needed.

    What gauge steel would be best for this sort of repair?

    I also just ordered some cans of Eastwood's internal frame rust encapsulator....for this job but also on my 2012 Ram's rockers.
     
  4. volare 77

    volare 77 Well-Known Member

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    I`m thinking it is roughly around 12 -14 gauge IIRC. Best to check the thickness when you cut the piece out This was the place that made the t caps. Mopar FJM Body Archives - autorust.com
     
  5. Oldiron440

    Oldiron440 Well-Known Member

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    I doubt that it was 20 gage to start with but that's probably what I would use, that or 18 gage and make it galvanized. Only remove as much galvanizing as necessary to weld and keep in mind that fumes from the galvanized metal are poison, so don't breathe them when welding. When I've done frames on unibody I've patched holes then gone back over the area and made a brace or renforment covering the area patched giving strength to a broader area. Sometimes this is fully welded and sometimes its plug welded or stitch welded on the edges or a combination of all the welds. On the frame rails I spend as much time as needed to do a repair that give it strength, durability while still maintaining a factory look.
     
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  6. XfbodyX

    XfbodyX Well-Known Member

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    I also just ordered some cans of Eastwood's internal frame rust encapsulator....

    Good god give this man a pat on the back and three adda boys, seriously do you know how many pics of body work, even on this site of quality metal repair work done only to see not a single bit of "old" metal treatment done. Almost makes it pointless to fix one spot and let another continue to deteriorate, but folks do it.

    I am highly impressed.
     
  7. shadango

    shadango Well-Known Member

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    Thanks... (I think?).....

    The "inside stuff" is scary cause you cant see it......

    I want to repair this "right".....not looking to just cover up anything....my son is driving it so I want it to be safe.

    Never saw this hole when we bought the car though I do recall that frame rail seemed a little crusty at the time....not sure if we missed it initially a few years back when we got it or if it progressed that much.

    Makes me sad to see the hole.

    The rockers and lower quarters have had a few small pinholes since we got it and it is what it is.....but frame, well it makes me sit up and take notice.
     
  8. volare 77

    volare 77 Well-Known Member

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    The thing about rust is generally a dime sized hole usually turns is a repair 20 times that size once you get all the rusted stuff out. The other rail probably will need a close inspection too. They seem to rust in pairs.
     
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  9. XfbodyX

    XfbodyX Well-Known Member

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    No I was serious, thats great you thought about it.

    I was working on one today thats not rusty though but it seems like the upper inner cowl is as thin as the rockers are in overall thickness.

    When our old cars were made what was the expected lifespan of them. How many times are we passed that?
     
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  10. Oldiron440

    Oldiron440 Well-Known Member

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    Wast of money, unless you remove it your just covering it up and it continues.
    The best way to do frame rails is sandblasting the backside and covering with epoxy.
    I've opened, sandblasted and repaired rails, pulled floors so I could get into the rails for sandblasting and epoxy but it's more that the average build. If it makes you feel good to encapsulate your rust go for it, somebody landed a big fish.
     
  11. XfbodyX

    XfbodyX Well-Known Member

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    EXPERT TEST not really

     
  12. Oldiron440

    Oldiron440 Well-Known Member

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    I've repaired rust on vehicles that some of those products have been used on and its my personal opinion after cutting and repairing or just beating on panel's that those products have been used on they are a wast of time and money.
     
  13. F body Deconstructor Jim

    F body Deconstructor Jim Well-Known Member

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    thats where they all seem to rot first...drivers side, right at the curve where it meets the floorpan.
    all the crap collects inside that corner and lays there, wet...

    cut it out and weld in a patch.
    I'd do a little abrasive blast to the area...inside as well...before any rust "treatment".
     
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  14. shadango

    shadango Well-Known Member

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    Yeah thats what I was worried about.....but so far right side looks OK......will see what the rest of the left side looks like as we get further into this.

    Having some cancer cut out of myself (versus the car) tomorrow, so wont be getting back to this for a few weeks at least.....
     
  15. shadango

    shadango Well-Known Member

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    Sandblasting and epoxy isnt a guarantee either...miss even a little bit of rust and it continues to grow. It may take years to notice but its there. So for all that work, the problem can persist.

    Other than 100% new clean metal, epoxied/painted and sealed and kept from the elements, steel will rust eventually. And even new metal will eventually....a few chips here and there provides the "in".

    SO really we are all just putting off the inevitable IMHO.

    Actually, I have had good luck with their "external" rust enapsulator....seems to stop or at least slow the progress considerably.....so figured i would try the "internal" coating.

    As far as internal stuff goes, it stays internal until it turns into a "cut and replace" scenario....so, even if this stuff slows it down a bit, that's worth it to me. I'm not gonna hack open rockers or frame rails that are looking good on the outside unless I knew they were rotten on the inside...would you?

    Having seen how encapsulators work, its worth the little bit of cash to me.
     
  16. shadango

    shadango Well-Known Member

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    Thanks.

    I know this stuff isnt a cure-all.....but if it slows down the inevitable, its worth it IMHO.....

    Thats all we are doing with these cars, especially if we drive them in the real world....trying to slow the process.
     
  17. volare 77

    volare 77 Well-Known Member

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    As far as I am concerned anything is better then nothing for rust prevention. BTW, good luck on the surgery.
     
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  18. XfbodyX

    XfbodyX Well-Known Member

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    Isnt the pass side where the cat converter and shield a bad area as well? Ive heard told the heating and cooling brought moisture to that area. I dont know.
     
  19. shadango

    shadango Well-Known Member

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    Thanks!

    Funny....I think addressing the rust on the VOlare and on my Cuda scare me more than my own issue....LOL
     
  20. Oldiron440

    Oldiron440 Well-Known Member

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    One thing if you encapsulate the rust...... it's still there! Your putting lipstick on a pig.
    If you make the effort to remove the rust with sandblasting, if done correctly it's gone.