Jack Meoff
Mopar Maniac
Doing all that without an extra set of hands.....wow!!
Great work man....you're inspiring the crap out of me..
Great work man....you're inspiring the crap out of me..
'83 Mirada street/strip project - my official return to FMJ!
- Thread starter 72Dodge
- Start date
72Dodge
Well-Known Member
Getting the headers in place would have been a heck of a lot easier with more hands, that's for sure. For me, the hardest part of working alone is that inevitably, every time I jump in the engine bay, that one tool I need is still in the tool box across the room... jump out again, get it, climb back in, and repeat each time LOL
Jack Meoff
Mopar Maniac
I feel your pain.
I was helping a buddy test fit headers today and doing that job alone has gotta suck...
I was helping a buddy test fit headers today and doing that job alone has gotta suck...
72Dodge
Well-Known Member
I'm coming to the slow realization that the Rivnuts aren't going to work, because the 3/8" ones are not even an inch tall. That weird indentation in the frame rail makes bracket installation a challenge. I guess I will look again at just welding it. I may have to bend 2 or 3 inches of the frame rail lip down (maybe not all of 90°, probably only like 45°) not only to let the bracket fit, but to get enough access to weld the bracket in.
I'm glad I took a break to think more about this.
I'm glad I took a break to think more about this.
I can see why you're beat! Nice to see real progress though, isn't it?
Personally I think you're better off welding in the frame tabs, just from a strength standpoint. I don't know that there's enough material in the rivet nuts to hold back the engine. Then again, I don't know how many you were going to use, either, or how far apart for that matter.
If it makes you feel any better, I spent the afternoon cutting the roof off my Challenger. I highly recommend not doing it, and I would also like to announce my renewed and considerably increased hatred for vinyl tops. This thing looks like it sat on its roof in a 6" puddle of saltwater for a couple of years. Ugly.
Personally I think you're better off welding in the frame tabs, just from a strength standpoint. I don't know that there's enough material in the rivet nuts to hold back the engine. Then again, I don't know how many you were going to use, either, or how far apart for that matter.
If it makes you feel any better, I spent the afternoon cutting the roof off my Challenger. I highly recommend not doing it, and I would also like to announce my renewed and considerably increased hatred for vinyl tops. This thing looks like it sat on its roof in a 6" puddle of saltwater for a couple of years. Ugly.
72Dodge
Well-Known Member
Yes, I would much rather install an engine than cut a roof off a car!
Thanks to Craig and his list, I no longer have to move my fuel tank over to clear the exhaust. I just have to cut those risers off so I can mount it flat with the sump through the trunk floor. AutoMeter gauge included.
Thanks to Craig and his list, I no longer have to move my fuel tank over to clear the exhaust. I just have to cut those risers off so I can mount it flat with the sump through the trunk floor. AutoMeter gauge included.
72Dodge
Well-Known Member
LOL... the way I first read that, I was thinking you meant I couldn't do those things due to not having any money left 
Fortunately, I don't golf, because I wasn't even thinking about trunk space. But if I do take it up, with no back seat, there should be plenty of room to shove some clubs back there. Because let's face it, I'll be lucky if I can ever find ONE other person who will want to ride with me in this thing, much less two or three!
Fortunately, I don't golf, because I wasn't even thinking about trunk space. But if I do take it up, with no back seat, there should be plenty of room to shove some clubs back there. Because let's face it, I'll be lucky if I can ever find ONE other person who will want to ride with me in this thing, much less two or three!
72Dodge
Well-Known Member
Worked for 10 hours on the Mirada yesterday but you'd hardly know it. I got the motor plate all set up, then realized I didn't really do it optimally, but that I could get it to work. (Otherwise, it's start over with a new motor plate, since I cut too much off to do it any other way.)
These weirdly shaped frame rails are really throwing me off. So I went to the hardware store to pick up some steel stock for welding and went to town. I'm not even 100% sure that what I'm planning is going to work, but it should. But now the main problem is that my welding sucks. I mean seriously sucks. I cannot trust my welds on a motor plate bracket setup. So for now, I'm going to take some time off to practice welding until I get it right, otherwise, I'll have to call a local welder to stop by to do it.
BLAST this previous owner for cutting the mounts off the k-frame. Not sure what he was thinking. Yes, I know I should have just found a good k-frame and swapped it out, but I didn't want to go through all that work either (and honestly, wouldn't have taken on the project if I had to do that, which is kind of the point I'm at with this now though, so... six of one, half dozen of the other). But, I WILL get this, one way or another. I'm WAY too far in now to stop. Just need to stop and think and/or get a local welder to help me or something.
Anyway... that's the status. Taking a short break, will come back later. I guess if I have to buy a new motor plate, I will. I hate to say it, but it's really looking like the best option to avoid a rube solution. I think while I typed this, I finally realized that. Then all I need to do is weld in some flat plates to the frame to flatten it out, then weld the motor plate brackets directly to that and I'm done.
How's that for a train of thought post...
These weirdly shaped frame rails are really throwing me off. So I went to the hardware store to pick up some steel stock for welding and went to town. I'm not even 100% sure that what I'm planning is going to work, but it should. But now the main problem is that my welding sucks. I mean seriously sucks. I cannot trust my welds on a motor plate bracket setup. So for now, I'm going to take some time off to practice welding until I get it right, otherwise, I'll have to call a local welder to stop by to do it.
BLAST this previous owner for cutting the mounts off the k-frame. Not sure what he was thinking. Yes, I know I should have just found a good k-frame and swapped it out, but I didn't want to go through all that work either (and honestly, wouldn't have taken on the project if I had to do that, which is kind of the point I'm at with this now though, so... six of one, half dozen of the other). But, I WILL get this, one way or another. I'm WAY too far in now to stop. Just need to stop and think and/or get a local welder to help me or something.
Anyway... that's the status. Taking a short break, will come back later. I guess if I have to buy a new motor plate, I will. I hate to say it, but it's really looking like the best option to avoid a rube solution. I think while I typed this, I finally realized that. Then all I need to do is weld in some flat plates to the frame to flatten it out, then weld the motor plate brackets directly to that and I'm done.
How's that for a train of thought post...
72Dodge
Well-Known Member
Or, maybe I could have a welder TIG weld back on the aluminum I cut off the motor plate LOL... after thinking for a bit this morning, I think I've decided I just need to backtrack and re-do the motor plate mounts the way I now realize I should have to begin with. Oops. I can think of this as 10 hours of hard-earned education. I'm going to lick this thing one way or another.
But right now, I'm taking my son to the State Fair to see the cows and pigs and Miss Dairy Aire. Well, that last one might be just as much for daddy as for son
But right now, I'm taking my son to the State Fair to see the cows and pigs and Miss Dairy Aire. Well, that last one might be just as much for daddy as for son
Whoa, wait... the motor plate is aluminum? How big is it? I'm not so sure I'd be all that cool with aluminum in a constant stretch/relax situation. Maybe I'm just paranoid, since I know they're commercially available but their primary use is race cars where they're not in constant use. It's under more stress in a high-horsepower, foot-to-the-floor situation, but not nearly as often.
Damn, I'm doing the same thing as you... thinking about it as I type. :icon_biggrin: It's a damned shame you don't live closer; my boss could probably weld 'em back together pretty quickly. On a side note, my welding also sucks and I need to do quite a bit of practicing prior to fabbing up custom accessory mounts for the Imperial and welding the new roof on the Challenger. :eusa_doh:
Damn, I'm doing the same thing as you... thinking about it as I type. :icon_biggrin: It's a damned shame you don't live closer; my boss could probably weld 'em back together pretty quickly. On a side note, my welding also sucks and I need to do quite a bit of practicing prior to fabbing up custom accessory mounts for the Imperial and welding the new roof on the Challenger. :eusa_doh:
72Dodge
Well-Known Member
It won't be in constant use, it won't be anywhere near being a daily driver, especially not the way I'm setting it up (4.10 gears, big cam). Plus, after the plates in, I'm also installing... what are they called... the torsion bar things or whatever they're called, and some auxilliary fabbed motor mounts too. I want to be real sure that engine stays in place both sideways and forward/backward.
I'd consider fabbing up some sort of steel plate, but I'm about fabbed out!
Back from the State Fair... that was fun, but hot out. After a rest, I may go do some more work on the car, but doing something else!
I'd consider fabbing up some sort of steel plate, but I'm about fabbed out!
Back from the State Fair... that was fun, but hot out. After a rest, I may go do some more work on the car, but doing something else!
72Dodge
Well-Known Member
Oh, and it's 1/4" aluminum. If I can get the thing in the first time, I can always put in a new one every few years or every time I swap engines if I need to.
72Dodge
Well-Known Member
It bolts between the timing cover and water pump.
72Dodge
Well-Known Member
Ahh... looking at the magnumforce website gave me a new idea for a totally different way of mounting this thing that may work out even better:
(not exactly, but something along these lines, without the cage of course)
http://www.magnumforce.com/cars/70_superbee_xrt/superbee_21.jpg
Of course, I still need a good welder or to get good at welding quick, doesn't fix that problem!
EDIT: Yep... I just went to look at the car again. It's so obvious to me now I was going about it all wrong. I can very easily see now how I can come in from the SIDES of the framerails, and fab up some very sturdy steel mounts from the sides... plenty of room there, and some nice flat rail to weld onto. As a matter of fact, I should have just bolted up the plate to the engine yesterday, because the plate can sit right on the frame rails for now. I'll do that next. I'll probably have to fab up something quick to raise up the engine from the rails a bit so the plate can still sit in the rails for strength once it's bolted in place (since I think I cut off about a quarter inch too much for it to sit on the rails... I can give it a bigger surface area to sit on this way, which is probably better anyway).
Sometimes ya just have to write out the thoughts, then walk away from something (ok, and have a beer) for things to start to make sense. Funny how when you get thinking about doing something one way, sometimes the brain just gets stuck thinking it's the only way, when the answer is sitting right there.
(not exactly, but something along these lines, without the cage of course)
http://www.magnumforce.com/cars/70_superbee_xrt/superbee_21.jpg
Of course, I still need a good welder or to get good at welding quick, doesn't fix that problem!
EDIT: Yep... I just went to look at the car again. It's so obvious to me now I was going about it all wrong. I can very easily see now how I can come in from the SIDES of the framerails, and fab up some very sturdy steel mounts from the sides... plenty of room there, and some nice flat rail to weld onto. As a matter of fact, I should have just bolted up the plate to the engine yesterday, because the plate can sit right on the frame rails for now. I'll do that next. I'll probably have to fab up something quick to raise up the engine from the rails a bit so the plate can still sit in the rails for strength once it's bolted in place (since I think I cut off about a quarter inch too much for it to sit on the rails... I can give it a bigger surface area to sit on this way, which is probably better anyway).
Sometimes ya just have to write out the thoughts, then walk away from something (ok, and have a beer) for things to start to make sense. Funny how when you get thinking about doing something one way, sometimes the brain just gets stuck thinking it's the only way, when the answer is sitting right there.
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I gotta wonder if that affects cooling since it widens the gap between the impeller and the timing cover... I mean, the cover's casting is pretty specifically designed as part of the pump housing. Just a curiosity question, or I guess a concern I would have if I were running one. I guess you'll be my anecdotal evidence on this one. :eusa_think:
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72Dodge
Well-Known Member
Well, oddly enough (not really) when I was test fitting the thing a few months ago (yeah, I work slow), I had the same question running through my head. From my neverending research, I have found that some people actually shave the water pump to bring it back in, or on more serious setups, they're using electric water pumps anyway. But, I've seen it done this way too, so we'll see.
The way I see it, this is a work-in-progress. I see this as my "race car" test bed ("because race car") long-term, at least that's the plan. Just got to get the thing together first So, if I can't get the thing to stay cool, I will go to whatever plan B makes sense, because shaving the pump or buying an electric pump are way beyond the current scope. (It seems to me another option might be a different impeller, but I don't know if anyone makes one, and this might be even more trouble to go to than shaving the pump housing).
My plan for this car has certainly evolved since I started this thread, but the direction I've gone has definitely become the type of car I trailer to the track and occasionally drive around town briefly, or take the kid to get ice cream in once in awhile... definitely nothing like a daily driver type situation. Based on the decisions I've made so far, I think I'm already well beyond that point!
I think I'm going to go putz with the motor plate, interior, and/or fuel cell for a bit. I have several projects going on at once, which helps when you run out of parts or patience for one or the other of them.
As always, Pierre, thanks for your input and support on this
The way I see it, this is a work-in-progress. I see this as my "race car" test bed ("because race car") long-term, at least that's the plan. Just got to get the thing together first
So, if I can't get the thing to stay cool, I will go to whatever plan B makes sense, because shaving the pump or buying an electric pump are way beyond the current scope. (It seems to me another option might be a different impeller, but I don't know if anyone makes one, and this might be even more trouble to go to than shaving the pump housing).My plan for this car has certainly evolved since I started this thread, but the direction I've gone has definitely become the type of car I trailer to the track and occasionally drive around town briefly, or take the kid to get ice cream in once in awhile... definitely nothing like a daily driver type situation. Based on the decisions I've made so far, I think I'm already well beyond that point!
I think I'm going to go putz with the motor plate, interior, and/or fuel cell for a bit. I have several projects going on at once, which helps when you run out of parts or patience for one or the other of them.
As always, Pierre, thanks for your input and support on this
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If I were going to fabricate a mount plate, I'd probably sandwich it between the timing cover and the block. That would absolutely require the cover to be milled so the oil pan seal would align, though. A mechanical fuel pump would be pretty much out the window at that point, too, but I don't use them anyhow. I wonder if a Flow Cooler-style impeller disc (or a Flow Kooler pump itself) would help. Are they still even in business?
Heh... speaking of working on stuff, I've got to go pull the cam bearings out of my 360. I'm not happy they have to come out, but at least I have a shiny new cam bearing tool I now get to use.
Heh... speaking of working on stuff, I've got to go pull the cam bearings out of my 360. I'm not happy they have to come out, but at least I have a shiny new cam bearing tool I now get to use.
72Dodge
Well-Known Member
Yeah, I've learned a lot since starting this project... there's a ****ton of stuff I'd do different if I started now, but c'est la vie. I did end up putting a plate over the mechanical fuel pump hole since I have everything I need to go electric pump except the pump itself and regulator, so... may as well go all out at this point.
I'll look up Flow Cooler out of curiosity... never heard of them.
I was just messing around (short on time today), and put on the chrome valve covers. Sometimes you have to do something "jus' for pretty" to stay motivated!
I'll look up Flow Cooler out of curiosity... never heard of them.
I was just messing around (short on time today), and put on the chrome valve covers. Sometimes you have to do something "jus' for pretty" to stay motivated!
