Rear end refresh

Projects & Restorations

  1. Justwondering

    Justwondering Well-Known Member

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    My brain is going to explode.
    Threadcleaner won't help. Looks like this is a problem best solved by a more 'direct' approach.

    JW
     
  2. Camtron

    Camtron Well-Known Member

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    Good punch and a big F’ing hammer to drive the broken studs out or if they screw in, a oxy torch to heat things up and some left hand drill bits and extractors to get them out.
     
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2019
  3. BudW

    BudW Moderator Staff Member

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    I corrected your statement a bit.
    The nitwit drilling portion is a secondary issue.

    You might want to take a close-up picture and start a new thread on this.
    I’m not that familiar with backhoes (large equipment) but have replaced my share of lug studs on many brands of autos/pickups.

    Most auto/pickup lug studs look like:
    Lug Stud.jpg
    Which are pressed into the hub.
    I’ve seen a few where the stud is screwed into the hub (but not many).
    Lug Stud Screwin.jpg

    The big portion of job is to get vehicle jacked off the ground, the tire removed, and brake drum (or rotor) removed. If the back side of stud is round, then it presses in. If it has a hex end, then it should unscrew (see above pictures).
    If your stud(s) are broken flush with hub or close to it. That said, you should be able to get by without using the official stud remover.

    For press in studs, the first part is to get a BFH (aka: A big hammer). A three pounder works well. A nail hammer will not cut it. It also helps to get a punch smaller than the stud and hammer the stub out, as shown.
    iuGTXLP507.jpg

    They make an official tool to extract stripped out or studs that are not broken flush.
    FH12APR_WHESTU_01.JPG

    The second best (or first best, according to some) is to use a press to press those studs in and out:
    Shop Press.jpg
    Not everyone has access to a press, though. It also requires more disassembly and reassembly (as well as the next option).
    This is an arbor press, which can work well, as well:
    Arbor Press.jpg

    The third best method (which requires more work, as above) is to use a big vice (the small to mid-size ones won’t do much.
    iu4OYPWGWM.jpg
    No matter which method you use, you will need to remove the brake drum (or rotor) to extract the broken parts.

    To reinstall the stud – most would use the same took you used to extract the broken part out – except for the hammer/punch method.

    This method works in many cases – but I recommend taking your new stud to a hardware store to get a sacrificial nut and washer for most likely both will be ruined getting a new stud in. Even passenger cars will tear up the nut and outermost washer. In some cases, it can even break the new stud.
    FH12APR_WHESTU_02.JPG

    It is possible, you might have to extract a good stud to find a replacement stud with.


    Getting off subject, if a lug stud looks questionable, I always replace ‘em. I’m in the process to overhaul four different differentials shortly and part of that will be replacing the studs on all eight axle shafts while axles are out (40 studs). A lot easier job to do when axles are removed from car.
    BudW
     
  4. Justwondering

    Justwondering Well-Known Member

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    boltsdouble.jpg
    Mine looks like the 3rd one down .... two different threads
    Its not a typical stud like in my fifth avenue or my trailers.

    At this point, rather than a BFH I'm thinking I need to weld a hex rod on it, pb blast it many times, and patiently see if I can back it off.

    I'll leave off on this thread and go back over to the 580k thread.

    JW
     
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  5. Camtron

    Camtron Well-Known Member

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    I’ve been putting all this off for a couple months but, I’m cleaning up the garage today and going to get started on getting the engine out of the car.
    Have new Aluminum water pump, aluminum timing chain cover, double row timing chain and gears, new harmonic balancer, new chain tensioner, new oil pan, new freeze plugs (already replaced the one behind the starter that was actively leaking) and more importantly: I actually feel great for the first time in a few months.
    I have a suspicion my rear main seal may be leaking too so, I’ll have a great access to that too, lol.
    I sealed the timing cover and water pump in a ceramic clear gloss to keep their natural finishes, I was going to clean and paint the block while it was out of the car. It’s a black roller block but, I think I may paint it Chrysler Corp blue.

    Edit: probably delete the a/c while I’m at things since, it’s empty and I wouldn’t use it anyway...Windows down, baby! Lol...well maybe delete the A/C in February when I can order a legit pulley kit.
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2020
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  6. BudW

    BudW Moderator Staff Member

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    I never have liked the Chrysler black engine paint. It looks to, um, unimportant or lame (or something). It does hide oil leaks, though.
    The engines I rebuild for my F/M will be painted but most likely will be Chrysler blue.
     
  7. Camtron

    Camtron Well-Known Member

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    Yea, the leak visibility IDS why I’m leaning to the blue; that and I’d feel a fraud painting my engine Hemi orange/Go mango, lol
     
  8. BudW

    BudW Moderator Staff Member

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    The Chrysler blue, turquoise, red and orange paints give some legitimacy to the engine. Black, um, doesn’t (IMO).

    The only two engine colors used for FMJ’s are blue or black. Black was stated in ’82 (I think).
    Blue was only engine color used from ’72-81 (or whatever year it changed to black).
    BudW
     
  9. Camtron

    Camtron Well-Known Member

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    weekend was a success.
    Have spent the day getting timing and carb all dialed in. I’ve gone from 10 degrees BTDC with the old, stretch timing chain to, 2 degrees BTDC with the new chain and tensioner. Air/fuel gauge, timing and vacuum are all happy and the seat of my pants and squat and squeal from the rear end when I floor the gas, gives a strong impression of a little new found power.
    Edit: Gas mileage is up too
    Here’s a question: to anyone’s knowledge, did stock, civilian, M-Bodies come with a, double row timing chain and metal timing gears from, factory? Because to my surprise, that’s what I found stretched on my engine; I was under the impression we had a single row chain with a plastic toothed gear. Can someone confirm?
     
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2020
  10. BudW

    BudW Moderator Staff Member

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    Taxi and police had what was refereed to as Heavy Duty (HD) engine and transmission. That included double roller timing chains, bearings instead of bushings inside torque converter and in other areas inside of transmission. It also cost more to manufacture and an expensive option.

    A person could special order a HD engine/transmission from factory (standard for police or taxi cars) – but I don't recall seeing anyone with that option.

    I've replaced a lot of the plastic timing chains when worked in a dealership – sometimes as early of 30k miles on car. If the vehicle history could be found, I would bet it is not the original timing chain – but anything is possible.
    BudW
     
  11. XfbodyX

    XfbodyX Well-Known Member

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    Post pics of the gears front and back, its easy to tell a aftermarket or store bought double roller vs the ones mopar used in that time period. Canada is your clue.
     
  12. Camtron

    Camtron Well-Known Member

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    Timing cover and cam plate are Chrysler marked, cam gear has a encircled M with numbers 8402, crank gear only has install marking.

    image.jpg
     
  13. Camtron

    Camtron Well-Known Member

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    Also, fender tag if that makes it easier for someone to answer.
    I don’t imagine that it was anything more than stock. Someone likely just replaced it previously.

    87A18AE2-8130-4FC5-A130-BEA258A80BEB.jpeg
     
  14. XfbodyX

    XfbodyX Well-Known Member

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    Looks like a old Melling gear.
     
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  15. BudW

    BudW Moderator Staff Member

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    The “M” is not for Mopar.
    Melling would be my guess, as well.


    Camtron 89 5th BEA258A80BE.jpg
    The fender tag looks like it says (reading top to bottom, Left to Right):
    25 0249
    MRB MSA NCA NDA ???
    HAB JPC LAC LAM ???
    AFF CBC CGT GCA GSJ G??
    C22 CH655501 VGX AMFS41
    APA PX6 AX6 SYM6 ELA
    DGA
    U VIN 1C3XM66P5KW******

    Of the above (my cheat sheet is at home, so don’t have my fender tag data with me), AFF is for the Fifth Ave rear boot. The ELA is 5.2L 2-bbl (Light Duty). DGA is A999 transmission w/lockup.
    Being there is an NDA on the fender tag, I wonder if I should even say anything? (hehe)

    The VIN is:
    1 – Built in the USA
    C - Chrysler
    3 – Passenger Car
    X – Drivers side Airbag, Passenger side manual Seat Belt
    M – M-body
    6 – Special/Sport Trim package
    6 – 4-door Sedan
    P – 5.2L 2-bbl (Light Duty)
    5 – Check Digit
    K - 1989
    W – Kenosha WI assembly plant
    Sequence number

    BudW
     
  16. BudW

    BudW Moderator Staff Member

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    I looked it up. The timing cam gear from Melling is part # s402. I can see ?402 cast into the gear but can’t make out the first digit. An 9, 3 or s – I can’t tell for sure.
    That said, I would say it is the Melling s402 part.
    BudW
     
  17. Camtron

    Camtron Well-Known Member

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    Gear has 8402 cast on it
     
  18. XfbodyX

    XfbodyX Well-Known Member

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    The question is was it a melling oem chain kit? Melling has produced oem parts for a long long time.

    I think Melling and ones like TRW back them were all interconnected.

    The Circle M is on alot of oem parts and even like this old performance cam from a oem vendor.

    DSC00095.JPG