Wheel hop

charlesvolare

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Last week I installed a Spartan locker in my 8.25 (lunchbox locker). When I accelerate hard and with traction I get pretty violent wheel hop, it's even happened in the rain. When I do a brake stand or purposely break the tires loose for a burnout and keep the tires spinning, no problems. No problems before, so I think it's axle twist.

255/60r15 tires, 5 leaf spring packs, OLD old shocks (waiting to do shocks when I do the iso-delete), iso-clamp system still there. The springs are very possibly worn out, those and the iso system are original from a '78 wagon. I'm piecing together parts, I have b-body shock plates and adjustable shocks picked out an ready to order. Would it be worth it to go ahead and replace the springs? What are some things to look for as far as if what I have are still okay to use? Recommendations on springs/shocks? Spring clamps, pinion snubber? Caltracs? I'm trying to do this without spending too much, but I want it to be a solid fix and to last.
 

Aspen500

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A pinion snubber closer to the floor pan would help a lot, as would good shocks if yours are weak.

Before I totally rebuilt my car from the ground up a few years ago, it had the original worn out 4 leaf springs that were shaped like an "S" and an 8 3/4" using the original iso set up, but even with the 440, there was zero wheel hop. It actually hooked up really good. Better than seemed logically possible and it only had P205/70R14's back then. The only thing I had done at the time of the BB swap (back in 1989 with basically no budget) was build a taller snubber to put the rubber about an inch from the floor contact area.
 

charlesvolare

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A pinion snubber closer to the floor pan would help a lot, as would good shocks if yours are weak.

Before I totally rebuilt my car from the ground up a few years ago, it had the original worn out 4 leaf springs that were shaped like an "S" and an 8 3/4" using the original iso set up, but even with the 440, there was zero wheel hop. It actually hooked up really good. Better than seemed logically possible and it only had P205/70R14's back then. The only thing I had done at the time of the BB swap (back in 1989 with basically no budget) was build a taller snubber to put the rubber about an inch from the floor contact area.

What's an easy way to build a taller one?
 

XfbodyX

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Just make an adjustable one like in the pic here.

If your gonna hit it hard id also in addition to the rubber end on the unit, cut a small 4x4 inch square of old 1/4 inch thick mudflap and use a couple tiny sheet metal screws to attach to your floor pan or you will be welding a patch in place after you beat/dent the piss out of your floor.

jj.jpg
 

charlesvolare

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Just make an adjustable one like in the pic here.

If your gonna hit it hard id also in addition to the rubber end on the unit, cut a small 4x4 inch square of old 1/4 inch thick mudflap and use a couple tiny sheet metal screws to attach to your floor pan or you will be welding a patch in place after you beat/dent the piss out of your floor.

View attachment 39933

That seems easy enough to make. What sort of clearance/adjustment increments do you recommend?
 

XfbodyX

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If I were gonna make one, id do adjustments in 1/2 inch.

This is on my low powered bracket/ street beater car although a stick car I like it close so the front end can work a bit.

This was when the rubber broke off and just before the mudflap on the pan pad.

DSC00483.JPG
 

volare 77

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A snubber is kind of a band aid to the problem. I would start with new 5 leaf springs and good shocks.
 

XfbodyX

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I think thats why for so many years a PS was a good add on any good street car with oem springs and decent shocks.

Only with costly springs and shocks did the snubber go away, but caltracks and calvert springs and shocks are like over 1k and a snubber can be done with stuff laying around.

Even with good springs, decent shocks and drag radials I never hooked well until the snubber, although being a stick car. And it still rides well.

But yea, good springs would be a plus but probably not a fix all. But also keep in mind our F-s were never really supposed to be a performance platform but rather a decal car, even with the added sway bars and 8 inch rims put on some, 160hp factory hotrod didnt take much to keep under control.
 

charlesvolare

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What are since good replacement springs? I've looked at Calvert's shopping monoleafs, I have a buddy who put a trick set of composite fiberglass set on his dart that weigh about 10 lbs that I was gonna look into.
 

Mikes5thAve

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Forget the snubber do new springs and shocks. There are a few places that sell springs online with easy to look up prices. Or see what you can get locally at a truck shop and avoid shipping. You shuoldn't have to do anything more then that if everything else is pretty much stock.
The type of tire and age can also cause it but you're main problem is worn parts.
 

Aspen500

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All I've got now are new 4 leaf springs with round spring eyes (rubber bushings) and regular Monroe OESpectrum shocks. Still running the iso set up using poly inserts. I've still got my modified snubber on the axle but at rest, it's like 2-3" from the floor pad so, it really isn't doing a darn thing probably. With the sagged springs, it was less than an inch away. Even still, there is zero wheel hop with P255/60R15 tires and 500" under the hood with "adequate torque" (lol). The springs came from Eaton Detroit Spring about 12 years ago.

I've got subframe connectors and maybe they help prevent wheel hop? That's a question btw.
 

Mikes5thAve

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All I've got now are new 4 leaf springs with round spring eyes (rubber bushings) and regular Monroe OESpectrum shocks. Still running the iso set up using poly inserts. I've still got my modified snubber on the axle but at rest, it's like 2-3" from the floor pad so, it really isn't doing a darn thing probably. With the sagged springs, it was less than an inch away. Even still, there is zero wheel hop with P255/60R15 tires and 500" under the hood with "adequate torque" (lol). The springs came from Eaton Detroit Spring about 12 years ago.

I've got subframe connectors and maybe they help prevent wheel hop? That's a question btw.

I've never had wheel hop with my 360 car. Worn springs but the ancient shocks have coil overs which I'm guess is what is really preventing it. No subframe connectors.

Im in the middle of replacing springs, shocks and adding front and rear police sway bars now.
 

Oldiron440

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Add aluminum bushings to the front eyes and your golden for performance.
 

charlesvolare

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Ended up ordering Calvert split-mono springs, competition engineering adjustable shocks, b-body plates. It might be a bit overkill on the springs but I'm willing to live with the stiffer ride. And I've been working on modeling up a hitch, I figure it could possibly help with towing if I get it finished up and end up making it lol
IMG_20200415_202133.jpg

If it works out maybe I'll make and sell a few too. Three pieces, attaches to the bumper shock mounts, clamps between the outside walls of the trunk floor pan and maybe a strap under the receiver that bolts to the bumper. It's still in the beginning stages for now.
 

BudW

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The rubber ISO clamp biscuits in addition to spring sag, worn leaf spring bushings (front and rear) and shocks are all compounding your problem.

Getting rid of the ISO clamps fixes most problems – even problems you are not aware of yet and makes the ride feel so much better. If not replacing the ISO clamps, then at least use urethane (or polyurethane) ISO biscuits and toss out those wore out rubber ones. The metal part of the ISO clamp is still a weak link – and just waiting for it to break somewhere inconvenient (so have tennis shoes in your trunk – in case you have to walk home).

The next items are for cars to be used on the street:
If you are getting new springs made, have them made with the '60's round front spring bushing:
Ft Leaf Bush.jpg


This is the FMJ front mount. I generally cut a bolt or stud to insert into the two holes to fill them – but that is me. Wore out 50 year-old rubber can be a problem.
MOOG sb364.PNG


If you are installing a rear sway bar (police or other) I would look into finding the rear spring shackle from a '84-95 Minivan (the same part number as the police shackle) and modify the rear spring mount for the wider shackle. This is a picture of the mini van shackle/rear spring mount vs. the police version.
20190110_165603a.jpg


I have details on Chrysler rear leaf springs – at Rear suspension options for an F body wagon ? . If you are considering changing to a different spring – I would read that forum post, first.
BudW
 

charlesvolare

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The rubber ISO clamp biscuits in addition to spring sag, worn leaf spring bushings (front and rear) and shocks are all compounding your problem.

Getting rid of the ISO clamps fixes most problems – even problems you are not aware of yet and makes the ride feel so much better. If not replacing the ISO clamps, then at least use urethane (or polyurethane) ISO biscuits and toss out those wore out rubber ones. The metal part of the ISO clamp is still a weak link – and just waiting for it to break somewhere inconvenient (so have tennis shoes in your trunk – in case you have to walk home).

The next items are for cars to be used on the street:
If you are getting new springs made, have them made with the '60's round front spring bushing:
View attachment 39966

This is the FMJ front mount. I generally cut a bolt or stud to insert into the two holes to fill them – but that is me. Wore out 50 year-old rubber can be a problem.
View attachment 39967

If you are installing a rear sway bar (police or other) I would look into finding the rear spring shackle from a '84-95 Minivan (the same part number as the police shackle) and modify the rear spring mount for the wider shackle. This is a picture of the mini van shackle/rear spring mount vs. the police version.
View attachment 39968

I have details on Chrysler rear leaf springs – at Rear suspension options for an F body wagon ? . If you are considering changing to a different spring – I would read that forum post, first.
BudW

I put in my last post that I went with purchasing Calvert springs and b-body shock plates to get rid of the iso in the rear. The springs come with aluminum bushings in the front and poly it the rear. Adjustable competition engineering shocks should stiffen everything up real good in the rear. I'll probably work my way forward and eventually replace the pucks up front as well as a firm feel box. But one project at a time lol
 
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