Steering Play

[Bruceynz]

As far as I know there are no kits to convert j or m to rack and pinion

 

[AJ/FormS]

If you get a blow up of the guts in that box and study how it works, you will see that some play has to exist in the box to trigger the boost valve. If you take out all the play by stiffening up the reaction springs, then you will have removed the I-want-boost-now signal, and basically have a manual box with a fast ratio, or at the very least, very little boost.
When you put thin reaction springs in there, you get lots of boost right away.
If you eliminate the play you will eliminate the boost,and the on-center feel will be very lively, and you may end up chasing the car all over the lane.
So you cannot eliminate the play and still be able to drive it
IMO yours is pretty close to right on. That's about how I set mine, but I installed a smaller steering wheel,lol.

 

[Oldiron440]

If I can get the compleat rack and pinion as a kit for my 64 Fairlane there has to be something for the Mopar

 

[4speedjim]

Ive seen B body racks advertised and maybe flaming river had an A body, but I'm not real confident the A rack was mass marketed. Ive thought about how I could run rack & pinion. Adapting something. Dakota? Mustang? LTD? Camero? What about oil pan clearance? I don't know enough to know where to start. Or how it ends. I think the closer to square and level its installed the better it will handle. Would you replace the drag link with a rack?
GM 600 series quick ratio steering gears for Camero, G bodies are popular upgrades. I think they're better on center, easy bolt it, but still not R&P. And R&P is the only thing used the past 35 yrs. So we're all accustomed to tight, but not dart-y on center feel. I looked into this when I first got my "Doba on the road. Then it all came back to me. R&P was arriving on all the new cars. Suddenly Brand New 80+ Ms - Js pick ups felt like you were adrift compared to the R&P FWDs that seemed to be on rails.
Bruce Its time for you to take us through adding R&P. You do a real good job documenting your builds.

 

[Bruceynz]

I would if I knew how but I am also cobbled by the law here, I don't think I am allowed to modify the steering in anyway with out it be checked off by an engineer and any welding has to be done by a certified welder, which means a shop has to do it, sorry jimbo no well documented post will happen! But if I don't move to far off stock and use lots of black paint I might be able to sneak it under the radar

 

[AJ/FormS]

I would if I knew how but I am also cobbled by the law here, I don't think I am allowed to modify the steering in anyway with out it be checked off by an engineer and any welding has to be done by a certified welder, which means a shop has to do it, sorry jimbo no well documented post will happen! But if I don't move to far off stock and use lots of black paint I might be able to sneak it under the radar

Remind me how many hi-way miles a year you think you might accumulate.

 

[Bruceynz]

so far this year none i get the idea, whats the point

 

[4speedjim]

I know Its only undesirable and not a safety issue. We build, swap, stroke, some big block. Sub frame, hang quarters, weld in floors. Shorten swap axles, 4 links and have a few efi Hemis prowling around. Why is R&P such a black art for us mopar guys? Bump steer seems to be the constant. Whether its our rear steer and R&P don't jive or it needs a strut or short/long arm? We should know what the cause and fix is. After decades of R&P its haed going back. fortunately theres lots of A body install threads online. Here s the first I found. A Body Rack and Pinion Converison

 

[AJ/FormS]

so far this year none i get the idea, whats the point

Cuz around town it's a non-issue. At least for me it's a non-issue. I had that box apart 3 times; first rebuilding it, then changing or adding reaction discs. Now it is fabulous, and I ain't interested in R&P.
But the front end now has more than 125,000 miles on it, and I sorta noticed a lil something getting loose, but I don't stuff it into the turns any more like I used to, beginning in 2000,lol. So we kindof grew old together.

 

[BudW]

There is a magazine article about using that Borgeson gear, in Mopar Action – a few years back.
If I can find that article, I will post it.

The steering gears used are from roughly 1960 to 2000+ (A, B, C, E, R, FMJ-Bodies and finally in B-Vans) are all “lacking” in a number of areas.
The FFI steering gears are an improvement over the factory gears – but as Aspen500 said, is still not up to today’s standards.


What Borgeson did, is take newer Jeep steering gear (from Grand Cherokee, I think), which is smaller, lighter and tighter, by design. They cut off the mounting ears off of the gears and weld new ears onto the gear. They re-spline the input shaft and output shaft, as well.

Sense they are physically smaller, it would make their use in non-standard combinations, like Hemi’s in FMJ-bodies, etc. - and still have P/S.

I’ve seen a couple setups in car shows – but not talked to owners about them, specifically.

The before mentioned magazine article does mention what they feel is a major problem in using the Borgeson gear and a work around to fix that problem. I don’t know if that work around is included in this package, or not.

I will try to find that article and post here, if you would like.

Otherwise – You can attempt to tighten your existing gear – but if it is fairly new to you, I doubt it will fix much.

I've got no information about installing Rack and Pinion style gears in our cars. I like the idea but just not sure about the actual install.
BudW

 

[Bruceynz]

I can't seem to find anyone who can tell me what a delphi (Borgeson) gear is like in the straight ahead position.

 

[BudW]

These are copies from two magazines I have. I know I have a third magazine talking about how Borgeson cuts off the Grand Cherokee Gear’s mounting tabs, re-welds tabs back onto the gear (to fit our cars) and also re-splines both the input shaft and output shaft splines as well – but I couldn’t find that magazine, at this time (Mopar Muscle, I think)

From my December 2008 edition of Mopar Action

Above are scanned pictures. Below is PDF copies of same pages.
BudW

 

[BudW]

From my October 2013 edition of Mopar Action

Above are scanned pictures. Below is PDF copies of same pages.
BudW

 

[BudW]

I found the third article, that I was looking for.

I also found online that Mopar Muscle has an article on installing the Borgeson gear into a '65 Coronet (for most details, the install will be the same as your J-body is). The article online is Steer Without Fear! How To Upgrade Your Mopar Steering Box! - Hot Rod Network . It appears I do not have that magazine.

Note: I do not recommend using the U-Joint – without some kind of up/down (fore/aft) movement allowance – or I foresee several potential problems in the future (cars do a lot of flexing).

This is from my April 2013 edition of Mopar Action:

I need to go to work, to make PDF versions.
BudW

 

[BudW]

I ran across even another magazine article about the Borgeson Steering gear (from the newer Jeeps).

This is from my December 2017 edition of Mopar Action.

I’m considering getting one of these, myself (if I can find $ to do so).
Above are scanned pictures. Below is PDF copies of same pages.
BudW

 

[Bruceynz]

Thanks for the info, I have been really busy on other things lately and haven't been on here much! But I will get into this soon I worked out that my car has about 1.5" play, the car holds a straight line, just that play grinds my gears!

 

[Bruceynz]

Where is page 71?

 

[BudW]

Advertisement.
I have the magazine at my desk, if you really want to see the ad.

Edit: actually, a pair of ½ page ads on page 71

 

[BudW]

I just got around to reading that particular magazine, a couple of days ago.

Currently, I have about a foot high (1/3rd of a Meter) stack of car magazines that I’m scanning select articles that I want to keep.
One foot high stack done, another foot high stack to go.
BudW

 

[BudW]

The last article I posted, is from December 2017.

The April 2018 edition, features the same car (a 1962 Savory . . . I think) but vehicle had been converted to a self-driving car – a pretty interesting read.
BudW